[2000jeeper]

I bought my RE lift used and replaced all the bushings with the new style before the install. I have had no problems. Even had one that was stressed from an accident i had and when i finally removed the axle and arm the bushing popped back to original form and i have been running that arm and bushing since with no problems.

Glockster i am running a 4.5 inch spring so i dont know but i can see what you are saying.

I also believe alot of the problems with the new bushing failure is from improper install

[atxzj]

Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford

To bring this back down to earth, let's all remember this is only about a bad batch of bushings. To indict an entire long-respected company over a single bad small component is pretty silly. To me, most of the blame goes to 4WP by not fixing it at no cost to the customer and then going to RE to make it right. Like taking a bad TV back to Fry's for a problem-free refund and Fry's handling dealing with the manufacturer which is the job of a dealer as 4WP was here.

RE isn't blameless and they need to readdress their policy where the bad bushing is concerned but don't burn the house down because the kitchen drain is backed up.

Jerry, neither logic or reason has any place in this thread. Move along........

[atxzj]

We installed, and wheeled REs "defective" bushing equipped control-arms on Jenn's LJ for over two years. Not one issue.

[billymac4511]

Originally Posted by ricko836

Most places usually don't cover labor for warranty work. I don't know of anywhere that does. We own our own business and we don't. We provide a replacement product and you are on your own to put it in. Your receipt most likely will say something to that sort. If you can get free replacement bushings, why not put them in yourself. At least you do not have to buy the bushings.

I worked at a radiator shop in Denver, CO.

When we sold a customer a radiator that had a bad TOC in it and a customer's tranny grenaded, we had to cover not only the cost of the radiator (that was defective) but also the cost of a new transmission AND the labor to replace both the transmission and radiator.

Talk about a $200 part we sold, costing the company upwards of $2500...

That's a perfect example of a part that's no good causing labor warranty claims. Exactly why you want to make sure you're selling a part that doesn't turn other parts into trash should they fail.

If you ask me to mow your lawn and say I can use your lawnmower, then I charge you 25 bucks to mow it, but I run down your cat while I'm mowing... You still owe me my 25 bucks, but I owe you a cat... (had I not been there, your cat would not be dead... my fault... I replace cat. ect...)

4WDParts should be charging RE for not only the replacement bushings, but also be charging RE for the labor to replace their defective part, not charging you for the replacement. They installed it, someone needs to cover labor, it was RE's junk part, RE covers the part cost and the labor cost... that is, unless they have some kind of B.S. fine print...

[glockster]

Originally Posted by atxzj

We installed, and wheeled REs "defective" bushing equipped control-arms on Jenn's LJ for over two years. Not one issue.

Holy crap man, I thought you were being polite to the misses when you called it "Jenn's" LJ. Looks like her driving. My wife loves my jeep and will even drive it, as long as there's pavement under it.

[atxzj]

Originally Posted by glockster

Holy crap man, I thought you were being polite to the misses when you called it "Jenn's" LJ. Looks like her driving. My wife loves my jeep and will even drive it, as long as there's pavement under it.

Thanks.

I never wheeled her LJ as it was too pretty and I had developed some somewhat destructive wheeling habits in my TJ I can tell you that its pretty cool having your girl into wheeling as you are.

[MeltdWhiskey]

Originally Posted by ricko836

Most places usually don't cover labor for warranty work. I don't know of anywhere that does. We own our own business and we don't. We provide a replacement product and you are on your own to put it in. Your receipt most likely will say something to that sort. If you can get free replacement bushings, why not put them in yourself. At least you do not have to buy the bushings.

interesting. ...every time i've taken any vehicle in for warranty work, the parts and labor were covered.

[NotURMailman]

I don't understand the people who say that shops usually don't cover labor and that 4WP shouldn't have to install the replacements for free.

I have run several shops, one being my own business. If I sold a part I ran a full warranty equal to the manufacturer's warranty. If the manufacturer's policy didn't have a provision to reimburse me for labor then it was on me. It was up to me which parts I would sell and offer a warranty on. If I failed to do my homework and sold a product with poor warranty support that was my fault and fell back on me, not the customer.

If I sold a part with a lifetime warranty I made sure to find out if the manufacturer was going to pay me for labor on warranty replacement jobs. If they were not I made sure that I had enough confidence in the product to risk multiple replacements where I would have to pay the technician out of my pocket.

If 4WP just found out about RE bushing failures 6 weeks ago then they are obviously not doing their homework on parts before selling them. I haven't bought anything from RE in years, but I knew about the bushing issues way before 6 weeks ago. If I was going to sell their parts I would have done some market research first.

When a customer requested a specific brand of part and I wasn't comfortable offering labor for warranty replacements I would always make sure that the customer understood that before the work was completed. I just don't understand how you guys are letting 4WP off the hook for this one. If the RE parts are parts of their normal product line and he bought the parts from them it's on them to stand behind the parts that they sell and install.

[Boundless]

Originally Posted by NotURMailman

I don't understand the people who say that shops usually don't cover labor and that 4WP shouldn't have to install the replacements for free.

I have run several shops, one being my own business. If I sold a part I ran a full warranty equal to the manufacturer's warranty. If the manufacturer's policy didn't have a provision to reimburse me for labor then it was on me. It was up to me which parts I would sell and offer a warranty on. If I failed to do my homework and sold a product with poor warranty support that was my fault and fell back on me, not the customer.

If I sold a part with a lifetime warranty I made sure to find out if the manufacturer was going to pay me for labor on warranty replacement jobs. If they were not I made sure that I had enough confidence in the product to risk multiple replacements where I would have to pay the technician out of my pocket.

If 4WP just found out about RE bushing failures 6 weeks ago then they are obviously not doing their homework on parts before selling them. I haven't bought anything from RE in years, but I knew about the bushing issues way before 6 weeks ago. If I was going to sell their parts I would have done some market research first.

When a customer requested a specific brand of part and I wasn't comfortable offering labor for warranty replacements I would always make sure that the customer understood that before the work was completed. I just don't understand how you guys are letting 4WP off the hook for this one. If the RE parts are parts of their normal product line and he bought the parts from them it's on them to stand behind the parts that they sell and install.

If I lived close to "Round Here" I'd take my Jeep to you for work... That's Service!

[NotURMailman]

Originally Posted by BoundlessBinder

If I lived close to "Round Here" I'd take my Jeep to you for work... That's Service!

It's just good business and customer service. It used to be pretty much common practice, but seems to be getting pretty rare these days.

I have always believed that word of mouth was the best form of advertising and going above and beyond for your customers not only brings them back, but brings in the people that they tell about it.

I don't do retail work anymore or run a shop. But if I did I would follow the same policies I always have.

I took over one shop not knowing that the previous manager was a straight up crook and it took me forever to get the local customer base to trust us. You can create a bad reputation very quickly, but creating a good one takes a lot of time and work. If you do right by a customer they will tell a few people and forget about it quickly. If you do a customer wrong they will tell a lot of people and remember it forever.

I would love to open up my own shop again, but the current economy is not a good environment to do so unless you have a lot of capital to get it going.

[Boodyrider]

4wparts sucks. Plain and simple, this is the problem.

I have RE arms, all 8, all Superflex2 and all adjustable. I bought them used, and they have been wheeled hard by the PO as well as myself. The rubber bushings are showing their age.... but not cracked.

MY arms were properly installed every time.

4wparts is known for the 'quality' of thier work, and their 'customer service'.

RE sells PARTS. They found what MAY be a parts issue, and may more likely be an installation issue. They have replaced bushings for, to my knowledge, EVERY customer who has so requested. This is the limit of their warranty and their liability.

Let me ask you this: do you seriously think Fram has EVER paid for an engine damaged by their filter failing? Their 'warranty' claims they would, but has so many loopholes I doubt it has ever actually been paid. I'm not convinced Fram would even give you a new filter.

OP, you MIGHT have something to complain about if you bought RE arms from RE and had RE install them... but if such a thing were possible, I have no doubt RE would have covered both parts and labor.

[Timberman]

Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford

To bring this back down to earth, let's all remember this is only about a bad batch of bushings. To indict an entire long-respected company over a single bad small component is pretty silly. To me, most of the blame goes to 4WP by not fixing it at no cost to the customer and then going to RE to make it right. Like taking a bad TV back to Fry's for a problem-free refund and Fry's handling dealing with the manufacturer which is the job of a dealer as 4WP was here.

RE isn't blameless and they need to readdress their policy where the bad bushing is concerned but don't burn the house down because the kitchen drain is backed up.

Jerry, I was waiting on you to "Chime-in" here..

I am of the position that "Customer Service" is what builds a company and without it, the business is doomed to fail.

For those of you who are employed or own your own shop, please take into consideration this sentence:

"It takes 20 years to build a reputation and five minutes to ruin it."

Yes Jerry, we are absolutely talking about a bad run of bushings.. We are talking about probably less than $100 worth of bushings and $250 worth of labor.. $350 is going to squander a relationship on both ends.. While speaking with RE, they stated, "if we were to pay labor for all of these bad bushings; we would go out of business.." NOT MY PROBLEM.. I'm thinking if they do not remove their heads from you know where they will be out of business sooner than they think..

Anyway, I have spent a TON of my own hard-earned money in an economy where that money would have been best served in other places and I am being treated like a second-class citizen.. Where do you think future dollars spent are going to go? Sure as H*LL not 4WP or RE.

I am steadfast in my loyalty with companies where I choose to spend money.. I am loyal to companies like Warn and will ONLY run their winches because they Stand behind their products 110% (sometimes they even go beyond) because these guys have a proven reputation of going outside the lines to take care of a customer..

Like I said previously; I am lacking the technical ability to perform major modifications myself, so therefore, I AM OUT IN THE COLD!! I pay people to do this and now I am just going to have to be a little more choosy when it comes to where I have work done.

Lets keep this going guys because you never know; RE and 4WP may get a clue..

[Timberman]

Originally Posted by NotURMailman

I don't understand the people who say that shops usually don't cover labor and that 4WP shouldn't have to install the replacements for free.

I have run several shops, one being my own business. If I sold a part I ran a full warranty equal to the manufacturer's warranty. If the manufacturer's policy didn't have a provision to reimburse me for labor then it was on me. It was up to me which parts I would sell and offer a warranty on. If I failed to do my homework and sold a product with poor warranty support that was my fault and fell back on me, not the customer.

If I sold a part with a lifetime warranty I made sure to find out if the manufacturer was going to pay me for labor on warranty replacement jobs. If they were not I made sure that I had enough confidence in the product to risk multiple replacements where I would have to pay the technician out of my pocket.

If 4WP just found out about RE bushing failures 6 weeks ago then they are obviously not doing their homework on parts before selling them. I haven't bought anything from RE in years, but I knew about the bushing issues way before 6 weeks ago. If I was going to sell their parts I would have done some market research first.

When a customer requested a specific brand of part and I wasn't comfortable offering labor for warranty replacements I would always make sure that the customer understood that before the work was completed. I just don't understand how you guys are letting 4WP off the hook for this one. If the RE parts are parts of their normal product line and he bought the parts from them it's on them to stand behind the parts that they sell and install.

Yeah, too bad my GPS cannot find "Round Here" because I surely would be heading your way for work..

[BlackBellamy]

Originally Posted by lumpster

Its not a bad batch, They were having them made overseas. Then come to find out the company that was producing those rubber bushing were adding filler to increase profit. Over time the ammount of filler was increased until it had a detrimental effect on the bushing. RE found out about it, found a new manufacturer and resumed the production with the 4 dimpled bushings, which are now proving to be junk just like the cheap filler bushing before.


So in closing RE fiexed the problem, which did not fix the problem.

It wasnt just a bad batch.

If you search around you will find that's the typical way a Chinese factory does business.

First they will show the gullible American businessman some good quality product. They will actually ship the good quality product initially. After some time, they will start to degrade the product quality, because that's an "easy" way to make profit. You lay off some QA guys, start using cheaper materials, etc. They do this incrementally, and then after some time they're shipping crap product. They hope to make their profit in the period of time between the end of the quality run and the time it takes for the gullible American businessman to wake up and complain.

[DKremers]

what i always find funny is how many people "know" how 4wp should run their business. obviously they are still in business and it works for them. its a big chain, how many big chains in any industry offer great customer service... there are some but its not the norm.

if a company tells you they can't afford to warranty a bad part its probably true. They must think its in there best intrest not to pay the labor for their business.

I run a tennis pro shop. if someone breaks a racquet they bought from the shop i will send it to the manufacturer to see if they will warranty it. Thats $10 bucks in shipping. Now should i have to put strings in the replacement racquet because it wasn't the customers fault the racquet broke, but it wasn't ours either....lets assume i do. i have to pay a stringer another $10, string cost approximately $10 depending on string. Now I'm out $30 bucks on this racquet. If the customer bought that racquet durring a sale of some sort all of a sudden the profit on that one racquet goes down to about $15. And if it happens again all of a sudden i'm losing money by selling the racquet. Hard to do business when this happens.