PA ticket for no doors

doeboy99 · 07-17-2010, 02:30 PM

Well it’s been ten years. Warned once and now I finally got a ticket. I’m not really sure if this is even against the law does anyone know. I was just going to pay it and chalk it up to a cool souvenir.

Got this in Pennsylvania on my way to the jeep show in york.

jeepjerryp7m8 · 07-17-2010, 02:42 PM

WOW he had your build sheet and knows that your Jeep was originally equiped with doors. HUH
Jerry

TheStigX · 07-17-2010, 02:45 PM

They should rename this or something..

Charge: Driving Vehicle at Safe Speed

doeboy99 · 07-17-2010, 02:47 PM

Yea apparently. He was cool though. He couldn’t really explain why or even if it was really illegal. He said he didn’t want to get into a debate on the side of the road.

Rocky_Cosmark · 07-17-2010, 02:49 PM

Yea,in the PA lawbook it says its illegal if its originally manufactured with doors,and they arent meant for removal,like if you had a xj and the doors were off,the big problem with doors being off is PA law requires a rearview mirror and also a driverside mirror on every vehicle,doors are fine to be removed if you have the mirrors still available

77j20 · 07-17-2010, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by doeboy99

Yea apparently. He was cool though. He couldn’t really explain why or even if it was really illegal. He said he didn’t want to get into a debate on the side of the road.

If he has no idea if it is even illegal then what business does he have writing you a ticket for it?

doeboy99 · 07-17-2010, 02:51 PM

Just found this. Think I may fight this one.

(f) Doors. A vehicle specified under this subchapter shall be equipped with doors of a type used as original equipment. The doors shall open and close securely unless the vehicle has been manufactured or modified to the extent that there is no roof or side. Tailgates, except on vehicles where the tailgate gives access to the passenger compartment, may be replaced with wood planking, nets or other material that will prevent loss of load. Tailgates may be removed when optional equipment, for example a truck camper, is added.

vanillathrilla · 07-17-2010, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 77j20

If he has no idea if it is even illegal then what business does he have writing you a ticket for it?

I'm with you on this one. I don't see why he wrote a ticket for it if he's not certain it's actually even unlawful. I don't see why it would be illegal anyway since they apparently offer no structural support at all to begin with.

monkers · 07-17-2010, 06:02 PM

my girlfriend and i went to the show in york, great show! about your ticket.....Pa is a state that you can legally ride your motorcycle without a helmet, but you got a ticket for no doors???? this doesnt seem reasonable to me??? I ride, and I wear a helmet (and i would even if it werent a law her in NY).............good luck fighting it...seems like bull**** to me............

moonshinefuel · 07-17-2010, 06:21 PM

It looks like we all have to be jeep lawyers now, and be able to defend ourselves on the spot, as some are getting a bit overzealous. After you get the ticket, its already a big mess, and will take a lot probably to un-do it, fight it, etc. Maybe we all need copies of the laws for our own states/provinces, etc. And keep them in our jeeps, so when pulled over, you can stand your ground, and very possibly not get that ticket. Its all about revenue a lot of the times. Is there a thread out there where you can get this info easily, make copies? You could attain the info yourself, yes, it would be interesting to gather up all the laws for wherever you live regarding this, and put them all in alphabetical order in one thread. (Printer friendly)

Axl Jack · 07-17-2010, 06:29 PM

Yeah, PA is one of "those" states. My cousin is a local cop and a friend of mine is a state trooper. Both have told me that it is technically illegal to drive without the doors, but both said the officer would have to be a pretty big jack*** to write a ticket (unless you decided to mouth off to them).

In PA, you can be cited for the following Vehicle Code Violation:

§ 4107. Unlawful activities.

(a) VIOLATION OF VEHICLE EQUIPMENT STANDARDS.-

(1) It is unlawful for any person to sell, offer for sale, lease, install or replace, either separately or as part of the equipment of a vehicle, any item of vehicle equipment affecting the operation of the vehicle which does not comply with this title or regulations promulgated thereunder, or which does not comply with an applicable Federal motor vehicle safety standard adopted by regulation by the department.

(2) Any person convicted of violating this subsection shall be subject to a civil penalty of not more than $ 100 for each violation. Each violation of the provisions of this subsection shall constitute a separate violation with respect to each motor vehicle or item of motor vehicle equipment or with respect to each failure or refusal to allow or perform an act required thereby, except that the maximum civil penalty shall not exceed $ 10,000 for any related series of violations.

(b) OTHER VIOLATIONS.-It is unlawful for any person to do any of the following:

(1) Willfully or intentionally remove (other than for purposes of repair and replacement) or render inoperative, in whole or in part, any item of vehicle equipment which was required to be installed at the time of manufacture or thereafter upon any vehicle, by any law, rule, regulation or requirement of any officer or agency of the United States or of the Commonwealth, if it is intended that the vehicle be operated upon the highways of this Commonwealth unless the removal or alteration is specifically permitted by this title or by regulations promulgated by the department.

77j20 · 07-17-2010, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Axl Jack

(b) OTHER VIOLATIONS.-It is unlawful for any person to do any of the following:

(1) Willfully or intentionally remove (other than for purposes of repair and replacement) or render inoperative, in whole or in part, any item of vehicle equipment which was required to be installed at the time of manufacture or thereafter upon any vehicle, by any law, rule, regulation or requirement of any officer or agency of the United States or of the Commonwealth, if it is intended that the vehicle be operated upon the highways of this Commonwealth unless the removal or alteration is specifically permitted by this title or by regulations promulgated by the department.

That's where the technicalities come into play. I don't think wrangler doors are required to be installed as they only provide protection from the elements. They are not put there for safety and it says so in the owners manual and on the roof.

Rocky_Cosmark · 07-17-2010, 06:40 PM

i had a few cops in scranton talk to me about my jeep,and they all said i needed a driverside mirror thats all,shows how well scranton cops know the laws,that explains a few things,theres always one guy who gets a jeeper for some law that is rarely enforced

daggo66 · 07-17-2010, 06:41 PM

There's already a huge thread about this. If this JA of a cop went to the show he could have written about 600 tickets. I drove there today with no issues.

**TJDaveX** · 07-17-2010, 06:45 PM

My TJ was not built with any doors. They were added by the factory when it was almost done.

In my case, they put on full doors. Other TJ's received half doors.

I have never been ticketed for no doors, but that's my story, and I'm sticking to it. I usually run my soft half doors when on the road just to make sure I have a life saving latch.