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Unread 09-04-2013, 12:23 PM   #181
Charley3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silvanus View Post
I'll look into that!
Into what? Hercules AT2?

If so, see the pics in post 162 of this thread. They are the best pics on the Interweb of those tires.

Also see http://www.herculestire.com/tire-gal...k/light-truck/

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Unread 09-04-2013, 03:26 PM   #182
silvanus
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I was answering WX on sidewall construction, I've been on Herc's site and their tires run small.

Can't justify paying for a 31 that's 30.2, not at all!

Herc's tires look very good though, too bad they're small, that's why they're priced on the low side!
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Unread 09-04-2013, 05:08 PM   #183
Jeeper44mag
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charley3 View Post
Why so down on Goodyear? They have made some junk in the past, and maybe still do make some (not sure).

I think most tire brands have made some junk, but I still like a brand if it also makes some good products too.

I know of 3 good Goodyear tires they make right now. Silent Armor (over priced, but good), Duratrac, and MTR-K. I even think their Wrangler tires are OK.


I'm a Cooper, Hankook, and Hercules guy, but I like many other brands too, including Goodyear. Not necessarily all their stuff, but some of it.
I can only speak to the Goodyear Wrangler tires. I have had 3 sets of them, and they all SUCKED. The tread life was pretty good when they didn't fail, but for some reason they seemed to pick up more nails than any other brand of tire I have EVER owned, and the traction on wet and dry pavement is VERY VERY poor.

In every case where I have replaced Goodyear Wranglers with another tire, I was IMMEDIATELY astonished at the HUGE increase in traction in every condition.

Currently running BFG AT's, and BFG "Rugged Terrain's", and some Cooper's (forget what model) on different vehicles (CJ7, Dodge 1500, Jeep Liberty), and am satisfied with all of them so far.

I have no idea how the Rugged Terrain's fare in serious off-road conditions, but on pavement wet and dry, the traction is exceptional. In light to medium mud, they seem to power my Dodge 1500 (open axle) through with no issues, and minimal slippage. MASSIVELY better in any case than the Goodyear Wranglers POS's that I had before (cheaper too).

Luis
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Unread 09-04-2013, 05:11 PM   #184
Jeeper44mag
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charley3 View Post

For a person who drives mostly on paved roads and gravel roads the stock Goodyear tires are great. Those Adventurer or Silent Armor would be great at that too, IMO. This tread pattern is great on highway and gravel roads. It's the only AT tread pattern I know of that doesn't pick up and retain any gravel.
You will only say this until the first time you try back to back comparison's of Goodyear Wranglers with any good brand of AT tire. BFG Rugged Terrains SMOKE them on wet and dry pavement, as do Coopers.

Luis

ps. Yes, I am biased. The three sets of Goodyear Wranglers I have run long term (over 90K miles between them) had horrible traction, and failed more often than any other brand of tire I have ever owned.... and were never covered under warranty either.
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Have: Metallic Silver '78 CJ7 Golden Eagle, 304 V8, ps., pb., A/C, ~3" Lift, 12.5"x33"x15 BFG AT's., T150/Dana20, Dana30/AMC20, 4.56 gearing, white hardtop.
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Unread 09-04-2013, 06:19 PM   #185
Charley3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silvanus View Post
I was answering WX on sidewall construction, I've been on Herc's site and their tires run small.

Can't justify paying for a 31 that's 30.2, not at all!

Herc's tires look very good though, too bad they're small, that's why they're priced on the low side!
Cooper and Hercules run small in some sizes, not all sizes.
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Unread 09-04-2013, 06:24 PM   #186
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Originally Posted by Jeeper44mag View Post
You will only say this until the first time you try back to back comparison's of Goodyear Wranglers with any good brand of AT tire. BFG Rugged Terrains SMOKE them on wet and dry pavement, as do Coopers.
I owned 2 sets of Goodyear Wranglers. They were OK, until worn out. They were poor when worn out, but that's true of any tire.

I owned 1 set of an old model Cooper AT.

I owned 2 sets of BFG AT.

I owned a set of Cooper ST.

I owned 1 set General Grabber AT2.

I currently own a set of Cooper AT3.

You've earned your right to your opinion about GY Wranglers. I have earned the right my opinion about Goodyear Wranglers.

IME they are reasonably good when new. Lousy when worn out. That describes most ATs, IMO.

There are many tires better than Wranglers for sure, but IME the Wranglers were OK until worn out.

If your experience with them differs, I believe you, but I also know what my experience was.

Would I buy a GY Wrangler? No. They were on my Jeeps when I bought them.
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Unread 09-04-2013, 07:32 PM   #187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silvanus View Post
I was answering WX on sidewall construction, I've been on Herc's site and their tires run small.

Can't justify paying for a 31 that's 30.2, not at all!

Herc's tires look very good though, too bad they're small, that's why they're priced on the low side!
I think you are mistaken. I have measured myself a LOT of tires...and the Hercules run BIG. In fact, almost all of Cooper's new stuff runs big.

The Hercules I just bought in 265/70-17 measures out .25" taller and .5" wider than every other tire this size I've ever put the measuring tape to. These tires are AWESOME for the money...in fact I'd put them up against any AT tire on the market right now. ANY AT tire.

The listed sizes of tires on manufacturers websites is misleading. They don't measure tires the same way you and I do.
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Unread 09-04-2013, 07:37 PM   #188
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Originally Posted by Charley3 View Post

Is the BFG AT heavier? How do you know? I have never found a weight figure for Cooper AT3.

I have personally weighed Cooper's new stuff. The AT3 in 265/70-17 is 40 lbs. A BFG the same size is 47 lbs. All of BFG's stuff is heavy, and they also run small. Cooper's stuff runs big.

The new ST Maxx is very heavy. It weighs 56 lbs. in this size...but it's a load range "E" tire and it's meant for heavy trucks.

The STT in this size goes 55 lbs.
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'12 Dozer JKU Sport S - 6-speed - ACE rock rails - Max Tow package - Daystar spacers - 33x12.50 Duratracs
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Unread 09-04-2013, 08:51 PM   #189
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Charley3 this is post #190 of this thread. I'm not saying that you need to get a life. Nor am I disparaging your extensive and well documented research; but just maybe?.... you need a little perspective on this quest of yours..............

A few years ago my girlfriend purchased new tires for her car,...... I asked her what kind of tires she obtained? She replied, "round and black"
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Unread 09-04-2013, 09:18 PM   #190
mschi772
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeeper44mag View Post
I can only speak to the Goodyear Wrangler tires. I have had 3 sets of them, and they all SUCKED. The tread life was pretty good when they didn't fail, but for some reason they seemed to pick up more nails than any other brand of tire I have EVER owned, and the traction on wet and dry pavement is VERY VERY poor.

In every case where I have replaced Goodyear Wranglers with another tire, I was IMMEDIATELY astonished at the HUGE increase in traction in every condition.
There are a lot of different GY Wranglers. You need to be more specific about which you're referring to. GY Wrangler Duratracs and GY Wrangler Silent Armor have proven themselves but are only two of many different tires in the Wrangler "family." The rest of that "family" are pretty awful.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HCallahan View Post
Charley3 this is post #190 of this thread. I'm not saying that you need to get a life. Nor am I disparaging your extensive and well documented research; but just maybe?.... you need a little perspective on this quest of yours..............

A few years ago my girlfriend purchased new tires for her car,...... I asked her what kind of tires she obtained? She replied, "round and black"
Tires are the single most important component on a vehicle in my opinion. Power is useless if you don't have proper traction for that power to push with. Braking is useless if you don't have proper traction. Turning is dangerous if traction is weak. A car that can't accelerate, decelerate, or turn safely or at all is no car at all. Ride quality is most affected by tires. MPG is significantly affected by tires. Yeah, I firmly believe that "round and black" is a foolish approach and that good research is priceless.
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Unread 09-05-2013, 01:36 AM   #191
Charley3
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Originally Posted by mschi772 View Post
There are a lot of different GY Wranglers. You need to be more specific about which you're referring to.
That is correct. We might not even be talking about the same Goodyear Wrangler tires.

There were several Wranglers that came stock on XJs. One of them I had and did not like. Another I had and did like OK. Two different tires, both called Wrangler.

Goodyear has so many Wrangler tires it gets confusing - maybe half a dozen different Wrangler tires.
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Unread 09-05-2013, 01:38 AM   #192
Charley3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HCallahan View Post
Charley3 this is post #190 of this thread. I'm not saying that you need to get a life. Nor am I disparaging your extensive and well documented research; but just maybe?.... you need a little perspective on this quest of yours..............

A few years ago my girlfriend purchased new tires for her car,...... I asked her what kind of tires she obtained? She replied, "round and black"
I didn't make all 190 posts.

I'm not the only person posting and keeping this thread going. Other people have interests and make their own posts. Participation is voluntary.

We're still learning new things and having fun too. Including recently learning about several tires not previously discussed.

Some of the good tires aren't well known, and aren't rated by any professional reviewers, and were therefore omitted from the OP, but are now being brought to light and discussed.

In addition to several long time participants, we have some new participants. This thread is alive and well due to ongoing contributions by many people.
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Unread 09-05-2013, 01:52 AM   #193
Charley3
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Originally Posted by WXman View Post
I have personally weighed Cooper's new stuff. The AT3 in 265/70-17 is 40 lbs. A BFG the same size is 47 lbs.
Were the 265/70-17 AT3 and BFG AT both the same load rating?

In a given size, you'd have to compare C to C, D to D, or E to E to accurately compare weight.
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Unread 09-05-2013, 07:03 AM   #194
HCallahan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charley3 View Post
I didn't make all 190 posts.

I'm not the only person posting and keeping this thread going. Other people have interests and make their own posts. Participation is voluntary.

We're still learning new things and having fun too. Including recently learning about several tires not previously discussed.

Some of the good tires aren't well known, and aren't rated by any professional reviewers, and were therefore omitted from the OP, but are now being brought to light and discussed.

In addition to several long time participants, we have some new participants. This thread is alive and well due to ongoing contributions by many people.
Lighten Up Francis
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Unread 09-05-2013, 12:41 PM   #195
silvanus
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Herc 31x10.5x15 AT2 is 30.2, wicked small for a 31", it should be their 30" tire!

I'm leaning towards an BFG AT KO ( 30.7 ), Goodyear Adventurer ( 30.8 ), or an Cepek Fun Country ( 30.8 ), all have stout sidewalls. I'd like the taller side of 30"!

I'm not into treading on peoples preferences on brand, type, or size.

I like this thread for it's real time info, and fellow Jeepers help!

Just that I'd like Tire companies to make a TRUE tire size and remove the to the nearest tenth math philosophy!!

Because their math philosophy just doesn't add up in my wallet!
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