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Unread 10-05-2006, 11:33 AM   #1
Fargo
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Just how weak are BFG sidewalls

OK, I know that BFG tires are used by many here and many rave about how great they are. Yet, at the same time I continually hear how weak the sidewalls are. So just how weak are the sidewalls compared to other tires? I recently put a hole in the sidewall of my Wranger GSA by hiting a small tree stump or something in the woods (I never saw what I actually hit). So now I'm paranoid about sidewall strength. Are the BFG tires something to be avoided because of this?

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Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
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Unread 10-05-2006, 07:02 PM   #2
al666
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i ripped a sidewall on one of my bfg mud terrain a day after i got them on a little tree stump on a trail. but my tire pressure was high around 40psi (gauge at gas station was 10pounds off), havent ripped one since runing the right pressure at around 30 pounds
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Unread 10-05-2006, 07:47 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by al666
i ripped a sidewall on one of my bfg mud terrain a day after i got them on a little tree stump on a trail. but my tire pressure was high around 40psi (gauge at gas station was 10pounds off), havent ripped one since runing the right pressure at around 30 pounds
That sounds a lot like my situation. I had aired up my tires to 32+/-psi because I thought I was done trail riding. Then I decided to do just one more. Thats when I ripped open the sidewall on my GSA on a small tree stump. I blamed the tire but I suppose the air pressure may have assisted. I don't know if the tire would have survived a lower air pressure impact or not. Either way I want a tire with a tough sidewall now. I really like the BFG all terrain but from what I've heard about the sidewall I'm keeping away from it.

Edit; Oh yeah, of course it alway happens with the new tires. My GSAs were brand new too. (They came with the Ravine rims I purchased from a fellow Jeeper)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
...there's very little that is more permanent than a temporary solution
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oman Jeep
Go with quality and cry once. Go cheap and cry often. Take your pick ;)
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Unread 10-05-2006, 08:10 PM   #4
paultyler
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People that rave about BFG sidewalls are people who have never challeneged them. I tore four sidewalls in one year on BFG MTs 33x12.5.15 and saw another friend of mine tear one as well. They are average at best. Why people try to say they are strong sidewalls is beyond me. I guess they have bought into the hype.

My experience with BFGs is that the sidewalls are very soft (tear easily) and very flexible. I had a real problem losing beads if I aired down less than 15 psi. Certainly if I went to 10-11 psi I would lose a bead 100% of the time. No, that is not a misprint...100% of the time. I attribute that to the soft flexible sidewalls.

If you get BFGs and you off road I highly recommend getting the tires at American's Tire and buying the free replacement warranty. That saved my butt 4 times over.
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Unread 10-05-2006, 08:20 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paultyler
People that rave about BFG sidewalls are people who have never challeneged them. I tore four sidewalls in one year on BFG MTs 33x12.5.15 and saw another friend of mine tear one as well. They are average at best. Why people try to say they are strong sidewalls is beyond me. I guess they have bought into the hype.

My experience with BFGs is that the sidewalls are very soft (tear easily) and very flexible. I had a real problem losing beads if I aired down less than 15 psi. Certainly if I went to 10-11 psi I would lose a bead 100% of the time. No, that is not a misprint...100% of the time. I attribute that to the soft flexible sidewalls.

If you get BFGs and you off road I highly recommend getting the tires at American's Tire and buying the free replacement warranty. That saved my butt 4 times over.
Well this pretty well confirms my fears. Sounds like it is just best to keep away from BFG if your going offroad. Thanks for the input.

Anyone else care to share a story?
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Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
...there's very little that is more permanent than a temporary solution
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Go with quality and cry once. Go cheap and cry often. Take your pick ;)
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Unread 10-05-2006, 11:03 PM   #6
Jerry Bransford
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I had BFG MTs and can confirm my sidewalls were always getting cut up. They were fine until rock crawling in sharp rocks became popular when the soft sidewall was discovered. That's when Goodyear charged in with their MT/R that had more cut-resistant sidewalls as one of their key goals. They did a good job achieving their goal. They're not bulletproof, I managed to cut an MT/R sidewall all the way through, but they're an order of magnitude tougher than BFG's MT. Which is why BFG later came out with the very tough Krawler to compete with the MT/R.
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Unread 10-06-2006, 09:38 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Bransford
I had BFG MTs and can confirm my sidewalls were always getting cut up. They were fine until rock crawling in sharp rocks became popular when the soft sidewall was discovered. That's when Goodyear charged in with their MT/R that had more cut-resistant sidewalls as one of their key goals. They did a good job achieving their goal. They're not bulletproof, I managed to cut an MT/R sidewall all the way through, but they're an order of magnitude tougher than BFG's MT. Which is why BFG later came out with the very tough Krawler to compete with the MT/R.
I won't be doing any rock crawling, but if a tree stump cut one tire it seems like it would cut another. So I'm wanting a tough sidewall to protect against that. I think I will keep looking.

I'm really considering the Dick Cepek FCII if I go with an all terrain. If I go with a Mud I'm considering the Mickey Thompson MTZ, Cooper STT, Firestone Destination, Dayton Timberline MT, or Kumho MT. I know its a pretty long list, but I have time to narrow it down. I'm just trying to get my facts in order first. The MTR is off the list purely because it cost too much for the amount of offroading I do.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
...there's very little that is more permanent than a temporary solution
Quote:
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Go with quality and cry once. Go cheap and cry often. Take your pick ;)
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Unread 10-06-2006, 09:47 AM   #8
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What size tire are you looking for? Shop around and you can usually get a pretty good deal. For 33 x 12.50 x 15 MT/R's most places started at about $200 per tire. With diligence I got Discount and Four Wheel Parts down to $145 each.
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Unread 10-06-2006, 10:01 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrimJeeper91
What size tire are you looking for? Shop around and you can usually get a pretty good deal. For 33 x 12.50 x 15 MT/R's most places started at about $200 per tire. With diligence I got Discount and Four Wheel Parts down to $145 each.
I'll be sticking with a 31x10.5. I'm not experienced enough to lift the Jeep and do trails I can't do with a 31" tire. That and it cost too much for how often I get out. I'm not trying to build a Jeep to impress everyone. I just want it to serve me well out on the trail. That means no breakdowns.

I'll keep the MTRs in mind if I can find them at a good price some time. But when you look at tirerack.com they are about $50 more per tire than the Kumho. (Just for example) I know the MTRs are a lot more tire. But at that price difference I can replace the Kumho tires 2.5 times. I've only tore 1 sidewall in the 4 years I had the Jeep so at this point the Kumho looks like a better deal. But I'm hoping to get out more so I'm keeping the MTR in mind. With that tire I would have more assurance when I do get in the rough stuff. Because it sure did suck replacing that tire on the trail in 100+ degree heat.

Please let me know if anyone has experience with sidewall strength on the other tires I mentioned.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
...there's very little that is more permanent than a temporary solution
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oman Jeep
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Unread 10-06-2006, 10:04 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fargo
I won't be doing any rock crawling, but if a tree stump cut one tire it seems like it would cut another. So I'm wanting a tough sidewall to protect against that. I think I will keep looking.

I'm really considering the Dick Cepek FCII if I go with an all terrain. If I go with a Mud I'm considering the Mickey Thompson MTZ, Cooper STT, Firestone Destination, Dayton Timberline MT, or Kumho MT. I know its a pretty long list, but I have time to narrow it down. I'm just trying to get my facts in order first. The MTR is off the list purely because it cost too much for the amount of offroading I do.
Unless you are rock crawling with sharp rocks, you aren't going to cut a BFG Sidewall. A BFG MT or AT is an order of magnatude stronger than a GY GSA. The GY MT/R is yet another order of magnitude stronger. But the BFG's are much better street tires. As with anything, it's a trade-off.
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Unread 10-06-2006, 10:14 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASUsax
Unless you are rock crawling with sharp rocks, you aren't going to cut a BFG Sidewall. A BFG MT or AT is an order of magnatude stronger than a GY GSA.


In addition, it really depends on how you hit a stump, or even roots for that matter. sometimes they'll cut any sidewall.

As per your choices, my Firestones were a GREAT tire, however the lugs tear on them fairly easy. That's mostly from playing on rocks on hot days. What is the terrain like where you wheel?
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Unread 10-06-2006, 10:27 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoUse328


In addition, it really depends on how you hit a stump, or even roots for that matter. sometimes they'll cut any sidewall.

As per your choices, my Firestones were a GREAT tire, however the lugs tear on them fairly easy. That's mostly from playing on rocks on hot days. What is the terrain like where you wheel?
I wheel a very wide variety of terrain. When I go to Minnesota its a lot of trees. The trails are mostly black dirt with scattered rocks. It can get muddy when it rains but I'm not one to play in the mud holes so I'm more worried about the top surface mud after a rain storm than the deep mud. When I wheel in the ND Badlands, its an arid climate with a lot of sandy soil. Some rocks, but they are mostly sandstone and don't poss a real threat for tearing sidewalls.

I've heard that Firestone tires tend to tear lugs off. But I don't have much for rocks to play on so I'm not too worried about that.

What I need is a strong tire to resist sidewall punctures with a semi agressive or aggressive tread that will wear well on the highway. I guess I should ask for reasonably quite to boot as well since I drive anywhere from 3 to 5 hours to get to my trails. (Isn't this the tire everybody wants?)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
...there's very little that is more permanent than a temporary solution
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oman Jeep
Go with quality and cry once. Go cheap and cry often. Take your pick ;)
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Unread 10-06-2006, 10:31 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASUsax
Unless you are rock crawling with sharp rocks, you aren't going to cut a BFG Sidewall. A BFG MT or AT is an order of magnatude stronger than a GY GSA. The GY MT/R is yet another order of magnitude stronger. But the BFG's are much better street tires. As with anything, it's a trade-off.
This is really good to know. I thought the BFG would have a sidewall similar in strength to the GSA. Does anyone else think the BFG is a stronger sidewall than the GSA? Jerry B or Paul T, do you think the BFG is really stronger or is it more marketing ploy. I know the BFGs are used so much its hard to seperate fact from fiction.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrblaine View Post
...there's very little that is more permanent than a temporary solution
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oman Jeep
Go with quality and cry once. Go cheap and cry often. Take your pick ;)
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Unread 10-06-2006, 11:47 AM   #14
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I've heard that some LT tires will have more plies in the sidewall. But the tougher the sidewall the handling and ride will be different. The LT Revos are 6 ply whereas the P series Revos are only 2 ply. Or something like that.
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Unread 10-06-2006, 01:18 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fargo
This is really good to know. I thought the BFG would have a sidewall similar in strength to the GSA. Does anyone else think the BFG is a stronger sidewall than the GSA? Jerry B or Paul T, do you think the BFG is really stronger or is it more marketing ploy. I know the BFGs are used so much its hard to seperate fact from fiction.
The GSA's a glorified car tire. POS. (But better than the even worse GY Wrangler ST's my KJ came with... )

The BFG A/T is a great street tire that's decent off road. The BFG M/T is better off road, but gives up a little bit on the road and in the pocketbook. Both wear like Iron, the AT a little better than the M/T.

The MT/R is a much more agressive tire that's great on rocks. Some people say they wear well, others don't. If you get MT/R's, don't get Rubi take offs, they are a slightly different tire than the 'regular' ones, and they just aren't as good. They'll be better at everything off road when compared to a BFG A/T, and better at everything but Mud than a BFG M/T. Conversely, they'll probably be worse on road than both BFG's.

Personally, I would say that if you put more than 10-12k a year on your Jeep on the road, you want a BFG. If you put 15k plus, I think you'll like a BFG A/T more than any other tire, just for it's outstanding road handling.

Whatever you do, step up in size, to at least 31x10.50. This is the biggest tire you can safely run off-road in a TJ. Think about a small lift to clear either 32x11.50 or 33x10.50 or 12.50. The Ravine wheels you have will handle a 10.50" wide tire, but you'd need spacers or new wheels to run anything wider, so keep that in mind. I would not go with the 30x9.5 size you are running now. That extra inch in both directions is very, very nice.
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