ZJ 94 318 stalling in reverse... - Page 2 - JeepForum.com
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post #16 of 49 Old 02-10-2011, 04:19 AM
FucusJeep
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my battery is oh lets say less then a year old, I had my alternater and battery tested the other day by a greaser at Partsource, he said my battery was reading low and my alt was fine. Im going to replace the fuel filter tomorrow (if my city has one) and for the alt I have to wait till next payday.

Unless i go to my salvage yards and pick up an alternater for cheap. I think I read that RAM 2500 alt are like 160amp or something so is that what i should look for first? I dont need the extra amps but whatever alt i pick up will only be $20 so i might aswell get a higher amp'd one right? any other vehicles I should look for an alt from? (once again i feel like im thread jacking sorry sorry sorry)

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post #17 of 49 Old 02-10-2011, 04:34 AM Thread Starter
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1. the t-case & front differential was already "killed" as the used driveshaft was warped/bent & took out the vc, & ground the pinion & ring gear bald. (so no real loss there) as it's all-ready done for. (I happened to have a 94 ram that's for parts/doesn't run & I dropped the t-case outta the jeep, & put the d/s from the ram right from the trans on the jeep back (so it's full 2wd for the time being, til I get the 242 (& yes ik I have to swap inputs)...

2. I'm not so sure it's an auto tensioner ( i might be mistaken) but i think the 93's era was different.
(basically you loosen the pump bolt, loosen the carriage bolt and ratchet on the assembly adjuster that runs under the pump.the power steering pump bracket is the tensioner, as I recall)

3. theres a hex bolt on the tb that the guy I bought it from said he quarter turned.(thinking valve position bolt, or tb throttle cable adjustment,as the bolt does seem to tighten/loosen the tension on the cable, thus changing the rpm's that it idles at.)

4. yes my spedo works, it might be throwing that code up bcuz recently I changed the guage cluster out for a custom (speedhut(dot)com) legacy cluster set.

5. I've ruled out the battery (see first few posts) as I have tried two different batteries (I bought a new one yesterday for the sake of trying it)

6. I think I'd vote alternator b4 the ecu, as a problem with the ecu would most likely cause other problems too.

...and as for the fuel dilevery problem,rough idling,hard start,etc. that turned out to be the loose IAS.
the only problem remaining is the drain on the battery while the vehicle is running, I can drive it now, but eventually the bettery will die, then it'll stall (hence the alternator) but thank you for trying to help.

oh and for the sake of throwing it out there, the starter is brand new, & so is the ignition, ignition coil, & all the battery cables/wires, as this is not the first time I've had this problem, but now it's rlly bad. (b4 I had a battery that kept goin bad due to a dead/bad cell) and I'm thinking that could explain as to why I'm now having problems with the alternator. I also know that the alternator makes a high pitch whine at times (usually when voltage drops) & sounds like ground/chewed bearings. & at night my lights used to flicker & dim while driving. (sorry if i seemed a little rude, but that is the reasoning of why I think it's the alternator) but as I have never had this exact problem b4 idk.

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me telling a friend of mine (who was freaking out) after I passed a semi on the freeway (using the dirt/grass shoulder) @ 70.
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post #18 of 49 Old 02-10-2011, 04:45 AM Thread Starter
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and dont worry bout "thread jacking" it's fine, ur havin' problems too. and try & get the fuel filter changed see if that might be ur problem (if your alt checked out fine) & charge the battery up & see if tht doesn't make a difference, if it doesn't it may be a short somewhere in your harness (i would think) or your alt is on its way out, ik mine tested "ok" but as i had it out of the vehicle at the time, it wasn't quite accurate. I had a friend (who is asa certified, & been at chrysler for 10 years) check the alternator while it was running, & found that it did check okay up until i started turning things on (like the hid headlights, radio/amp, on board compressor,etc,etc.) the more power I tried to use the weaker the voltage got & even though the vehicle tried idling at a higher rpm to compensate(guessing ecu voltage reg.) but it didn't help, still started draining the battery. (for all i know maybe I need an alternator with a higher output to handle everything on board, but somehow i doubt it, as turning on the headlight alone, tend to make a significant impact on the rate it charges at)

btw, I think oem/stock 90 amps should be more than fine for your vehicle, but I am not certain, of course you can go higher.(but you may need to replace the wiring to handle the higher amps/volts, just like u would in a car with a 60 amp alt. upgrading to a 90+)

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me telling a friend of mine (who was freaking out) after I passed a semi on the freeway (using the dirt/grass shoulder) @ 70.
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post #19 of 49 Old 02-10-2011, 11:14 AM
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1. the 4wd overdrive unit is NOT supported properly to use as a slip yoke. DO NOT DRIVE THIS VEHICLE!
2. all magnum v8's are auto tensioner.
3. you "can" alter the idle with the throttle plate stop. BUT YOU SHOULD NEVER TOUCH IT. idle is 100% computer controlled. the stop only keeps the plates from scoring the walls if they touch. the stop is set from the factory such that the plates are closed enough to prevent air passage but not stopping by hitting the walls hard. DO NOT ADJUST THIS. again, DO NOT ADJUST THIS.
4. cluster has nothing to do with codes, there is no feedback given to the ecu. you have a vss problem if the code came up.
5. the battery will fail if you continue to drive with an undercharging system.
6. the ECU is the voltage regulator, if you have voltage and charging problems the voltage regulator is fried. the correct fix is replacement of the ecu. you can work around this by wiring in the external voltage regulator from an early 90's dodge truck.
you've tested the battery, you've tested the alt. all that's left in the charging system is the ecu. if the battery temp sensor were bad you'd get a code, but not the voltage swings.

btw, the v8's did not come with a 90 amp alt. the non-tow package i6 models did. the v8's have a 116a or 136a alt.

'97 zj 5.2, some stuff, some other suff, and some things that even work sometimes.

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post #20 of 49 Old 02-10-2011, 11:57 AM Thread Starter
jeep94318gc
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ratmonkey View Post
1. the 4wd overdrive unit is NOT supported properly to use as a slip yoke. DO NOT DRIVE THIS VEHICLE!
2. all magnum v8's are auto tensioner.
3. you "can" alter the idle with the throttle plate stop. BUT YOU SHOULD NEVER TOUCH IT. idle is 100% computer controlled. the stop only keeps the plates from scoring the walls if they touch. the stop is set from the factory such that the plates are closed enough to prevent air passage but not stopping by hitting the walls hard. DO NOT ADJUST THIS. again, DO NOT ADJUST THIS.
4. cluster has nothing to do with codes, there is no feedback given to the ecu. you have a vss problem if the code came up.
5. the battery will fail if you continue to drive with an undercharging system.
6. the ECU is the voltage regulator, if you have voltage and charging problems the voltage regulator is fried. the correct fix is replacement of the ecu. you can work around this by wiring in the external voltage regulator from an early 90's dodge truck.
you've tested the battery, you've tested the alt. all that's left in the charging system is the ecu. if the battery temp sensor were bad you'd get a code, but not the voltage swings.

btw, the v8's did not come with a 90 amp alt. the non-tow package i6 models did. the v8's have a 116a or 136a alt.
well Excuse me mister "know it all" but my 318 is not the stock motor that you think it is, nor is the ecu & "brain" of the vehicle. I have an aftermarket mopar/allpar H.O. 318 (bored/stroked to 340) with an s/c for intake off of the tb. & the "brain" computer circuitry is out of a 98 5.9 (360) and has the superchips control module. & the code of the vss, idk what ur refering to "that there IS a problem" but ik for a fact my spedo works fine & is accurate. and btw yes there is a 90 amp alternator on my block, & there is a spring/bracket tensioner, I know this because I am looking right at it! also in 1993 to early 94 there were some weird combo's that chrysler put out, for instance the occasional 93/94 318 with a 242 selec trac case, or 231 command trac case, there was also differences in transmissions, differentials, & other components for those years. the 96-98+ years had a lot more electronic controlled peripherals & devices. a lot of the early 93/94's were still using mechanical devices, vacum pumps & high pressure lines, I know this because I have worked with many people at chrysler assembling the parts for these vehicles. since u seem to know so much, do you know the difference between the factory chrysler 318, & the aftermarket mopar replacement H.O. 318? there's 3 main differences. and what you said about the d/s is a bunch of bs, it's the same d/s and trans as they put in the early slant 6 automatics (an Aisin Warner AW4 that was re-geared for the 318), just with an overdrive gear. & yes it is safe to drive or I wouldn't be driving it for the last 2 months. and another tip for ya, u change the fuel filter every 60,000 miles or 48 months. here's the proof that the 5.2s came with 90amp alt's. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeep_Grand_Cherokee (the 5.9 came with a h.o. 150a alt.) try try again... oh, & idk if u can figure this out on your own or u might need help, so read carefully. The VSS doesn't effect my speedo or my vehicles speed, all it does is read the speed of the vehicle at it's wheel & send the info to the ecu to translate to the transmission to tell it when to shift, and fyi my sensor is disconnected that is why my trans shifts quicker as it's not getting input from ecu, but going by rpm's instead!

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me telling a friend of mine (who was freaking out) after I passed a semi on the freeway (using the dirt/grass shoulder) @ 70.
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post #21 of 49 Old 02-10-2011, 01:40 PM
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aw-4 based v8 trans with an added overdrive? does that mean you have TWO overdrive ratios now? if it weren't so sad i'd be laughing even more right now.

advice was given based upon how your profie is filled out. if you can't be bothered to provide pertinent info then i can not be bothered to help you.
using a 5.9 ecu? man that must have been fun pulling all the wiring for obdii spec stuff.

carry on with your stupid.

'97 zj 5.2, some stuff, some other suff, and some things that even work sometimes.

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post #22 of 49 Old 02-10-2011, 02:32 PM Thread Starter
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the aw4 never had an overdrive, hence I said it was added in the first place. my info is correct as to what it is and will be, I have had the trans, rear driveshaft, and many other things changed "temporarily" until I get the cash to put it back to the way it was ty very much, & i didn't build the aw4 I just have the word of the mechanic who put it in. also the ecu from the 5.9 was already pulled, & it wasn't hard to install seeing the whole car was gutted in my garage last summer (& wasn't running until october).
and my specs for the trans, or how I'm running my driveshafts, or 4wd, has nothing to do with my original question/problem, and that is a constantly dead battery & stalling after x amount of time it's been running.
and thank you for your concern,but I do not require your help. seeing your trying to get me to buy a whole new ecu, & rewire something that is blatantly/obviously a alternator problem, or grounding issue. (now maybe if the ground that was bad happened to invole the ecu then maybe i'd consider checking into it, but seeing it isn't i don't think so. and btw I got the new alternator today & installed it, it's running fine all day, & the ground that was off was the one under the hood closest to the battery, i'm guessing it possibly broke/jared loose when the fron-end bit the dust some few months ago, as it was on the freeway at 70, & cause quite a bit of vibration. and I wasn't trying to be an *** about anything I was meerly just stating what i know, have been told, or led to believe, but thanks.

and it's "stupidity" not "stupid." and if you think that's what it is then so be it... granted i'm not perfect nor want to be, & idk everything about my vehicle but I do know some things. as for the belt tensioner, you can adjust/tighten it manually, but it is set up to auto tension also, that is how I got the belt back on after replacing the water pump.

and nice halo projectors btw,they look good. thinking of getting some by spec-d tuning that look identical only there smoked... (and out of curiosity are u using the h1/h3 bulb setup?)

"It's a jeep thing, It was made for that..."

me telling a friend of mine (who was freaking out) after I passed a semi on the freeway (using the dirt/grass shoulder) @ 70.
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post #23 of 49 Old 02-10-2011, 02:55 PM
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ratmonkey has alot of knowledge in the area of the 5.2. i have seen so many noobs on this forum ask for help from some of the veteran members only to end up in a pissing contest that they eventually lose.

read ratmonkeys profile, he knows his way around a zj. you might want to start listening instead of being a jacks$$. he has been invaluable to me in my 5.2 swap in my yj.

my only question is... why the hell did you leave an aw4 behind the v-8?

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post #24 of 49 Old 02-10-2011, 03:04 PM
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my question is how the hell did he PUT an aw-4 behind a chrysler small block pattern v8...

he may want to read up on what an aw-4 actually is...when he's probably thinking about the chrysler/torqueflite a-series 3spd hydraulic transmissions. the aw-4 has always been a 4spd overdrive trans.

i did mean carry on with your stupid, i used it as a noun not an adjective.

you had a lot of problems, not once did you mention wiring issues, front end damage, motor and engine management swaps...etc, etc. no one can provide proper advice if we're basing it off of a stock equipped vehicle such as your profile lays out.

'97 zj 5.2, some stuff, some other suff, and some things that even work sometimes.

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post #25 of 49 Old 02-10-2011, 03:49 PM Thread Starter
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okay guys. 1. I'm not saying ratmonkey is not knowledgable at all, I'm just saying what he is/was suggesting would not help with my problem. 2. I didn't put the aw4 behind the v8, the previous owner did, I was simply telling you the specs of the vehicle when I bought it! my profile specs are as it is now. minus 4wd. and I was going on info I had gotten from a local jeep,chrysler,dodge mechanic. and I do know what the aw4 is http://jeepzj.hamcar.info/gpage6.html and my vehicle was originally a 4.0l car, it was totaled in a front end accident in 97 down in texas, then somebody bought it as a salvage, rebuilt it with the aftermarket v8, & left the aw4 trans in(according to guy I bought it from), after i bought it the trans was slipping, I had a rebuilt 46rh put into the jeep. and all ik is the v8 that's in mine had a 90 amp alternator in it, after today it now has a 150amp alt. & when I had the old ecu & wiring pulled out It was obdII (wich means that is not the original engine) so swapping the 5.9 harness/computer in was that big of a problem, sure I had to make mods here and there. and the last thing is he may know his way around a stock zj or his year range zj (96-98) but the specific one I have is far from stock or normal, as it's been through hell & back as I found out from the vehicle history report, & u said I wasn't giving enough info, yet I tried giving all the info I could, without guessing. I eventually figured out my problem by myself with the help of people I know, & real experts, not some philly wannabe mechanic who thinks he has it all figured out. oh, & since u wanna know everything about the vehicle (even useless sh17) the vehicles production line number is 666 and it came off the jeferson assembly line march 26th. 1993 it was a 4.0l limited with a dana 30 front 35 rear, & was changed in 97 to a 5.2 h.o. 318 dana 44 rear stock front, v8 coils,shocks, and kept the stock aw4 tranny (for some stupid reason) and at that time it had the np231 comand trac transfer case. it now has the matching 249 for the v8 (or did) and soon will have a 242 in it & a woody's d/s. it also had a class III reciever hitch installed. and btw the difference between the regular 318, & the mopar MPI H.O. is higher flowing fuel rails/injectors, camshaft/valve lifters, & exhaust manifolds. (check the mopar site- crate engines, for more info). sincerely, a detroit guy. peace out.

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me telling a friend of mine (who was freaking out) after I passed a semi on the freeway (using the dirt/grass shoulder) @ 70.
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post #26 of 49 Old 02-10-2011, 04:08 PM
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you can not physically bolt an aw4 to a 318, the bell housing patterns and sizes are not similar.

take a read through my build thread. i know my way around quite a bit of a grand cherokee in any form you'd like to take it.
i'm building a 10.5:1 na408, my 318 has heads, intake, injectors, headers, i built my exhaust myself, 5spd swap(one of FIVE v8 grands currently running a manual trans and one of those is a chevy swap too), etc, etc, etc.
if it CAN be done to a grand i can tell you what parts you'll be able to buy, what you'll have to make, how difficult the work will be, what vehicles cross reference mechanical parts, what manuals you will absolutely need for wiring, etc.
i didn't get my post count through witty banter alone. i try to help people, i LIKE helping people, but if you don't give as much pertinent info as possible you can't be helped properly.

as for your issue, you said you tested the alt and the batt and they were both fine. that leaves only two possibilities the ecu or wiring. the 98 ecu has the voltage reg in there as the 94 did. since the alt is grounded through the accessory bracket and there's multiple grounds to the motor, since the motor runs at all that rules out the ground wiring. since voltage was fluctuating it may have been the pos lead, the field exciting lead or the ecu.
since it works with a new alt it's now obvious your alt was tested improperly as it was bad. hopefully that is the real problem.

you may not think this info is pertinent, but we can't see your vehicle and those "real life experts" can and don't have to ask for such things like we do on this text based interactive message board.

'97 zj 5.2, some stuff, some other suff, and some things that even work sometimes.

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post #27 of 49 Old 02-10-2011, 04:45 PM Thread Starter
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okay I understand that & thank you. I have no Idea what trans was originally in it when i bought it then?? i haven't had very good info from the guy i bought it from and it wasn't me who said my alt was fine it was fucusjeep, i had already figured it was my alternator due to the noises it was making... and yes i hope this solves this problem... i guess we'll see. and your right and i'm sorry for being a jack @... it's just been stressfull (if it's not bad enough that it's -5 here with wind,the jeep was also stuck in a snow drift & that's what I have had to work with as I could not start it long enough to move it out of the snow bank, it wasn't getting enough power to push through) but thankfully it's done now & hopefully it'll last,so again my sincerest apologies, & your info has helped a lot also. so ty. ...and don't get me wrong I like workin' on my jeep, it's almost an obsesion...but i didn't really plan on taking a day off work to try to fix my jeep... lol

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me telling a friend of mine (who was freaking out) after I passed a semi on the freeway (using the dirt/grass shoulder) @ 70.
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post #28 of 49 Old 02-10-2011, 10:09 PM
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Sorry I confused your info with the other posters. That's why we should encourage people to start their own threads, even if their problem seems similar to them it often isn't.

'97 zj 5.2, some stuff, some other suff, and some things that even work sometimes.

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post #29 of 49 Old 02-10-2011, 10:22 PM
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ha ha he called you a philly wanna be mechanic. i peed a little when i read that.


glad to see you took advice. these forums can be a wealth of knowledge if you chose to use them for that and not just talk about how awesome your mall crawler rims are.

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post #30 of 49 Old 02-11-2011, 12:08 AM Thread Starter
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@ratmomnkey, yeah it's ok, i kinda figured that might of happened, & yeah that's true.

@mike breaker 5, I hate my mall crawler rims,lol jk... and yes the forum does have some great info, & i'm always open to advice. IK this was one of the first places I came when I was looking to re-do my front differential back b4 october (info on gearing, backlash, recommended brands,etc.) & the people were awesome & helped me. (I just wish I would of bought a new d/s along the way instead of everything but) It turned out to be something I'd later regret... and btw,yeah i said a lot, it's been a seemingly endless few days... and again guys srry for bein' a jack (wagon)...

"It's a jeep thing, It was made for that..."

me telling a friend of mine (who was freaking out) after I passed a semi on the freeway (using the dirt/grass shoulder) @ 70.
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