Was this necessary? 98 5.9 Luimited Dana 44HD question - JeepForum.com
Search  
Sign Up   Today's Posts
User: Pass: Remember?
Advertise Here
Jeep Home Jeep Forum Jeep Classifieds Jeep Registry JeepSpace Jeep Reviews Jeep Gallery Jeep Clubs Jeep Groups Jeep Videos Jeep Events Jeep Articles
Go Back JeepForum.com > Models > Jeep Grand Cherokee & Commander Forums > ZJ Grand Cherokee Forum > Was this necessary? 98 5.9 Luimited Dana 44HD question

Dan's Old as Dirt Birthday Sale!Premium LED Lighting by VISION X, Proudly sold at ROCKRIDGGEARSHADE Pocket Tops in stock and available at ROCKRIDGE

Reply
Unread 07-08-2013, 06:30 AM   #1
jenniferny
Registered User
1998 ZJ 
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Lockport, NY, New York
Posts: 141
Was this necessary? 98 5.9 Luimited Dana 44HD question

I have a 98 niner with 69,000 miles. The bearings went bad in the Dana 44HD rear axle. i was told I needed a new case. This is what the 'old' case looked like when I got it back.

I can not see and corrosion or damage to the threads. Has anyone ever seeen this happen before or had to do this to their case to get the c-clip out? Why would this have been necessary? I think it has a E-torx bolt that holds the C-Clip. Do they usually break or get frozen and not come loose when disassembling the rear end? Isnt there a way to get the bolt out if it does freeze or snap withouut having to destroy the case?

I have read some of the Dana 44HD threads and havent seen this in any of the ones I read. I am not familar with changing the bearings so I had to have it done for me. I was told that a new case was only $125, but when I checked before ordering it, the $125 was for a Dana 35 and a Dana 44HD case was almost $700, so the shop thought my Jeep had a Dana 35, not the Dana 44HD that it actually does have.

Isnt there some way to remove the bolt without destroying the case if it is stuck or breaks? I would think that a heavy duty, probably Grade 8 bolt, would have been used and that the E-Torx fastner would be at least adequate for the task of C-Clip retention. Is there a problem with the design or the bolt or the E-Torx being used in this situation?

BTW, the small white 'thing' on the threads is a piece of the towel I used to wipe the dust off.

dana-44-carrier-damage-boces-02b.jpg   dana-44-carrier-damage-boces-05b.jpg  
__________________
Jennifer
jenniferny is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-08-2013, 06:56 AM   #2
riot1987
Registered User
1997 ZJ 
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: In your attic, with the squirrels and wrapping paper
Posts: 3,534
Looks like the shop couldnt get the bolt out that holds in your cross pin for your spider gears. Looks like they cut your carrier to remove it. I know its tight getting those out at times and Ive almost stripped one myself. BUT if they stripped out the bolt and then are going to charge you for a new carrier, thats BULL****!
__________________
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f22/riots-97-grand-1436100/

Build thread^^
riot1987 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-08-2013, 06:57 AM   #3
riot1987
Registered User
1997 ZJ 
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: In your attic, with the squirrels and wrapping paper
Posts: 3,534
At this point, Id say that your carrier is trash. You will need a new one. I would hit up a junkyard for one if you can. I would also go back to the shop with a big stick and some questions.
__________________
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f22/riots-97-grand-1436100/

Build thread^^
riot1987 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-08-2013, 08:38 AM   #4
jenniferny
Registered User
1998 ZJ 
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Lockport, NY, New York
Posts: 141
Spider Gear Cross Bolt

Quote:
Originally Posted by riot1987 View Post
Looks like the shop couldnt get the bolt out that holds in your cross pin for your spider gears. Looks like they cut your carrier to remove it. I know its tight getting those out at times and Ive almost stripped one myself. BUT if they stripped out the bolt and then are going to charge you for a new carrier, thats BULL****!
riot1987 Thank you for answering my post!! This is an area (differential internals) I am very weak in. The shop was suppose to change the axles and bearings in my 98 5.9. They were not doing anything with the Trak-Lok or anything else, just bearings.
Why would you have to pull the bolt for the Spider Gear Cross Pin if you are just trying to change the inner and outer bearings for the axles? Is that necessary or recommended? Why would you want to or need to remove the bolt for spider gear cross Pin? I hope I am making sense and you can understand what I am trying to get at.

Thanks again for your help!!!!
__________________
Jennifer
jenniferny is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-08-2013, 09:06 AM   #5
dnuccio
Registered User
1995 ZJ 
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 3,482
to pull the axles out, they need to remove the cross pin so the axle will move inward far enough to pull the c clip out. but if they cut up your carrier before asking you if they could and letting you know the cost of a new one, they should be paying for a new carrier IMO.
__________________
Reliability is relative
R.I.P. Ratmonkey
dnuccio is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-08-2013, 09:13 AM   #6
PolkaPower
Registered User
1998 ZJ 
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: The Abyss, MD
Posts: 15,803
Never had that problem with my D44a or 35c. That trac lok carrier is trash now. Don't let them replace it with an open carrier since the 5.9 came with a trac lok.

Like said above, to change the wheel and carrier bearings you have to take the pin out to remove the C- clips first. Then you can slide the axles out and remove the carrier.
PolkaPower is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-08-2013, 10:20 AM   #7
jenniferny
Registered User
1998 ZJ 
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Lockport, NY, New York
Posts: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by PolkaPower View Post
Never had that problem with my D44a or 35c. That trac lok carrier is trash now. Don't let them replace it with an open carrier since the 5.9 came with a trac lok.

Like said above, to change the wheel and carrier bearings you have to take the pin out to remove the C- clips first. Then you can slide the axles out and remove the carrier.
How common is it for these particular bolts to break?
It never happens,
it happens sometimes,
it happens sometimes but not often,
it rarely ever happens.

Im just looking for opinions.
This is the first time I was there, and I have had other issues with this shop while my Jeep was there, for example.

New Parking Brake Shoes & cables installed, but didnt replace with new or free uo the two pivot points (see photo) so the parking brake shoes will work, both sides were still frozen and the parking brake didnt work and one of the cast steel parking brake cable mounting points on the axle was broken off.

Left Front wheel almost fell off on my way home. Two lug nuts were tight(155 & 115 ft lbs), right next to each other. The other three were loose, one was only on by 1 or 2 threads and the other two could be turned with my fingers.

I didnt request an oil change. They changed my oil anyway & threw out Mobil 1 that had lots of miles left. They put in basic 5w30 (not recommended in the 5.9 over 60 degrees F) and put on a new filter. The filter was leaking bad enough to cause smoking from oil on the exhaust pipe on my way home.

Needless to say, I am not going back there- EVER! The issue for me is damage that was done while my Jeep was there, easily over $1000 worth not counting what I listed above.

BTW, that is what the parts looked like when I removed them. They were properly cleaned, painted and then lubed before installation. Would any one on this forum install a part that looked like that and was seized and didnt work properly????? I couldnt... I didnt.
parking-brake-actuator-rod-01-frozen-not-lubricated-before-assembly-01.jpg   parking-brake-cable-mounting-boss-broken-off-01.jpg  
__________________
Jennifer
jenniferny is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-08-2013, 10:35 AM   #8
PolkaPower
Registered User
1998 ZJ 
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: The Abyss, MD
Posts: 15,803
Wow they really screwed things up and you could have had a bad accident. You are right I would never go back there for sure. I would have to say that it is not a common bolt to break. Mine had no issues when removing it.
It's not easy to get money back from a shop that does you wrong but you may have a good case here. After a few times getting burned myself as a teenager, I started to learn to work on things myself. I don't like taking it to shops ever. When I do I ask around for the best/ honest shop from the local 4x4 clubs. Out in Las Vegas it was easy to find a good mechanic because off roading is very popular. Not so sure about where I live now so I hope I never have to take it in for something above my abilities.


Here is a link with pictures of how to remove the axles. The pic of the bolt is in post 3 http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/forums...d.php?t=482547
PolkaPower is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-08-2013, 10:42 AM   #9
airwolf9090
Registered User
1996 ZJ 
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Clyo, Ga
Posts: 559
If i was you i would make that shop pay another shop to fix everything they broke or caused to break, Or take it to another shop have them do an estimate on cost of repairs of what that other shop did then take it to small claims court, Any good shop would of let you know before they started to cut anything that would cost you extra money
__________________
1996 Jeep ZJ Orvis
airwolf9090 is online now   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-08-2013, 10:43 AM   #10
airwolf9090
Registered User
1996 ZJ 
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Clyo, Ga
Posts: 559
One way to find a good shop is to find one that will let you hang around and watch them work,
__________________
1996 Jeep ZJ Orvis
airwolf9090 is online now   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-08-2013, 11:30 AM   #11
dnuccio
Registered User
1995 ZJ 
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 3,482
the shop should be paying for all these things they broke IMO.
__________________
Reliability is relative
R.I.P. Ratmonkey
dnuccio is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-08-2013, 11:30 PM   #12
Lwister
Registered User
1996 ZJ 
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: San Diego, ca
Posts: 6
Dana 44a damage

One possibility is the cross shaft pin bolt could have been loc tighted in but from the pictures I do not see any on the threads. It could have beeen cleaned off. The correct way to remove the bolt that has been loc-tighted in is to apply some heat with a torch. This loosens the loc-tight and will allow the bolt to be removed. If the bolt head snapped off when removed, it could have been drilled out. I have never seen in 40+ years of working on cars a diff. distroyed in this manner.
Lwister is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-08-2013, 11:59 PM   #13
riot1987
Registered User
1997 ZJ 
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: In your attic, with the squirrels and wrapping paper
Posts: 3,534
I call bull****. That shop is a joke. As stated, you can replace that carrier with an open one that may save you some money. If anyone hacked up my parts before asking me what was up, Id be extremely upset. Id try to take it up with the shop if you can. If they were worth a **** they would replace the parts they damaged. At this point that carrier is trash. Before you took it in, that carrier was repairable. At this point they ****ed it up beyond repair which, IMO is hog **** and not acceptable.
__________________
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f22/riots-97-grand-1436100/

Build thread^^
riot1987 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-09-2013, 03:14 AM   #14
Timo_90xj
Web Wheeler
 
Timo_90xj's Avatar
1998 ZJ 
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Helsinki, Finland - on the European side of the Atlantic
Posts: 5,322
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lwister View Post
One possibility is the cross shaft pin bolt could have been loc tighted in but from the pictures I do not see any on the threads. It could have beeen cleaned off. The correct way to remove the bolt that has been loc-tighted in is to apply some heat with a torch. This loosens the loc-tight and will allow the bolt to be removed. If the bolt head snapped off when removed, it could have been drilled out. I have never seen in 40+ years of working on cars a diff. distroyed in this manner.
True, although the space to drill out a broken crosspin bolt on the D44a is fairly tight - but doable. Heat works on a lot ofg bolts, I've used heat from a torch on crosspin bolts a couple times when I've felt they're a bit stubborn to get off. There really is nothing inside the carrier that would suffer from a little heat on the crosspin area. That shop did an unbelievably crappy job with your Jeep, did you really pay them? They'd need to pay you for the damage they did and also for causing you a risk of an accident by not properly torquing the lug nuts.


This is the exact reason I don't really trust any shop, even if it's an official stealership shop. If I take my vehicle to a shop, I'm standing right behind them watching what they do, no matter if they like it or not I've had a a Ford dealer repair shop trying to rip me almost 1000 from a 30 000km service that should've only cost third of that. They had done a ton of unnecessary work on the vehicle that wasn't even required and that wasn't approved by me. I made them an offer I won't complain about this to the media or parent company if I only need to pay for the basic maintence they were supposed to do. They accepted my offer
__________________
1998 Grand Cherokee 5.9 LX daily driver, 1.75" BB, 32" KM2s, HPD30 Eaton e-locker/D44a stock LSD, 4.56 gears, custom- fabbed tube bumpers and tube fenders,...

http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f13/d...s-etc-1222317/


1990 XJ Limited (4-door), 4.0 I6, AW4, NP242, ***rolled and totalled @ 165k miles***

***Under construction***
1990 XJ (4-door), 4.0 I6, AW4, NP242, PBR 42" tires, Unimog 404 portal axles, 110" WB, full cage + uniframe completely rebuilt, front 3-link + panhard / double triangulated 4-link rear,... ***SOLD***
Timo_90xj is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 07-09-2013, 05:51 AM   #15
Technohead
Old School
 
Technohead's Avatar
1998 ZJ 
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Exeter, RI
Posts: 6,536
The $700 is probably for the trac-lok case which is a POS anyway. Just get the normal open case.
Technohead is offline   Reply With Quote




Jeep, Wrangler, Cherokee, Grand Cherokee, and other models are copyrighted and trademarked to Jeep/Chrysler Corporation. JeepForum.com is not in any way associated with Jeep or the Chrysler Corp.