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Unread 10-06-2011, 06:06 AM   #16
LilViper95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scubamc View Post
Have you removed all the factory dash to see what is behind there yet? There are some structural supports that will probably prevent the relocation of the radio and a/c heater controls.
What structural supports are you speaking of? Here is a pic of my 93 with the dash removed. The only support behind the dash is for the steering column?!?



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Unread 10-06-2011, 06:12 AM   #17
youngjeeper11
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Maybe support is not the right word, more of a....mounting plate....its removed in your picture. Its the sheetmetal peice that goes from side to side that the speedo, speakers, radio, HVAC controls all mount to.

But your picture is where I want to start from, basically replace everything

The white one in the picture would be pretty easy, Ill try to whip up a quick model during lunch
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Jeep 1:Used to have a 93 YJ 2.5l- 3.5" Black Diamond, Chevy TBI 5.7l V8, SM 465 4 speed, 8.8 rear( 4.10, L/S), rhinoline, Mile Marker 9000, NP 231, Had to sell it due to college
Jeep 2: 89/91 YJ, 4BT Cummins, NV4500, NP 231, Old Man Emu 2.5" suspension lift, 1" body lift.....Runs and drives, but very much a project
Interned at Novak Conversions 2 summers ago

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Unread 10-06-2011, 06:36 AM   #18
Jax89Jeeper
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Quote:
Originally Posted by youngjeeper11
I just dont understand the desire for a flat CJ style dash haha.
.
The desire for the flat dash is easily explained... The original purpose of the CJ style Jeep was straight utility, the flat dash keeps with that. Form follows function and in a trail rig keeping your knees out of the dash is a big issue that the flat dash remedies. At 6'5" tall, this is a real concern.
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Unread 10-06-2011, 06:59 AM   #19
youngjeeper11
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I'll keep that in mind, I can create a lot more knee room than just a flat dash would be recessing the dash under the steering wheel a few inches.

And I am trying to get away from the straight utility feel. I want my YJ to be more comfortable to drive, but at the same time get rid of the plastic to make it more...rugged and trail ready.

I am at a constant battle of comfort Daily Driver issues and Trail Rig issues, I want my YJ to have the best of both, which I think many of us try to do.

I'm trying to improve function too

I'm 6'3" and have never had a knee to dash issue....guess its the extra 2" you have on me.

Maybe I will just finish my design and you can criticize it then haha


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jax89Jeeper View Post
.
The desire for the flat dash is easily explained... The original purpose of the CJ style Jeep was straight utility, the flat dash keeps with that. Form follows function and in a trail rig keeping your knees out of the dash is a big issue that the flat dash remedies. At 6'5" tall, this is a real concern.
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Jeep 1:Used to have a 93 YJ 2.5l- 3.5" Black Diamond, Chevy TBI 5.7l V8, SM 465 4 speed, 8.8 rear( 4.10, L/S), rhinoline, Mile Marker 9000, NP 231, Had to sell it due to college
Jeep 2: 89/91 YJ, 4BT Cummins, NV4500, NP 231, Old Man Emu 2.5" suspension lift, 1" body lift.....Runs and drives, but very much a project
Interned at Novak Conversions 2 summers ago

Ask me about my 4BT Cummins Motor Mounts!!
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Unread 10-06-2011, 07:31 AM   #20
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Here is mine before I bolted it in. The radio and CB are in the Tuffy console. The raw piece was done by Dan Dillner of DoubleD Fab.

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Unread 10-06-2011, 10:10 AM   #21
GrantYJ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by youngjeeper11 View Post
scuba mc- I have torn apart YJ dashboards like 86838 times haha. I will probably remove the steel flat support that the speedo/tach radio and heater controls mount to all together and replace with one I design. I am planning on running new cables and everything all together, what I would really like to do is make everything electronically controlled, I think that would be cool, but maybe just cables for now. In my initial design you can see 2 rectangle cutouts in the middle for the radio and heater controls, the top two are heater vents.

Aaron J- I agree, who has that many switches anyway!! haha

GrantYJ- I don't plan on using the factory AC, I might try to source an aftermarket AC set up that I can hide somewhere behind the dash instead, but not really my priority

My YJ has a 4BT cummins, I ditched the factory gauges a long time ago, I still don't have a working speedo, just because I am having a hard time finding an electronic speedo that I can calibrate (I have a super short SYE with the electronic sender) as well as a tach that I can set up with a diesel that match each other, and are not stupidly priced

Basically, what I am going for is tearing everything out, starting from nothing, and making it what I want it, but I also want to create a few configurations, because I hope to develop a kit to sell that is semi-customizable.

I am pretty experienced with laser cutting and robotic bending, none of this will be done by hand besides final assembly, and everything with be held together by a lovely thing called Rivnuts or nutserts, which makes blind threads in sheetmetal possible.

Im not really looking for tips on how to do it, I have my bases covered, I am looking for what other people might want in a dash, and I am quite surprised at some of your responses haha, I just dont understand the desire for a flat CJ style dash haha.

Anyway, keep the ideas coming!
Very impressive sir. I thought long and hard about a 4BT swap. It seems like it would be a very good setup for a YJ.

As far as the CJ style dash goes, it's a combination of nostalgia and function. For me, my least favorite cosmetic aspect of my YJ is the dash. It's covered in plastic, isn't user friendly, and just looks and feels cheesy. My offroad experiences as a very young child took place in old scouts, CJs, and Willys. Those vehicles were why I bought my Jeep in the first place.

Jax89Jeeper also hit the nail on the head. My Jeep was a DD for several years. Now it's my hunting / weekend offroad / bad weather rig. The carpet has gone away and Line-X has taken it's place. The ability to fit a gun case more easily or toss in tools and equipment far outweighs any urge for the "cushy factor" for me.

The only thing that I could really recommend would be panels similar to the green dash. If built like your model, the gauges, switches, and controls would be much less convenient to work with. You also have no good way to incorporate a panic bar.
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Unread 10-06-2011, 11:07 AM   #22
youngjeeper11
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Ok, I can understand the nostaligic thing, I am really going for function here, and no plastic, and I mean you could Line-X the whole dash.... haha

How do you figure the guages and controls would be harder to work with? Maybe its hard to really visualize scale in the model, but everything is pushed up and about 6" closer than stock,

I have a huge custom shifter on my NV 4500 that is a little long, however in this model, if my trans was in 5th gear, I could reach only about 4" past the shifter to the radio, if that makes sense.

we all have different arm lengths, however, what I am getting at is with the way I have it measured in the model, I would be able to reach the radio and controls with my arm 3/4 of the way stretched out with my back flat on the seat, how is that less convenient than reaching way down half way to the floor?

and how are the gauges more difficult to see? thats where they are in 90% of cars, not to mention they are 6" closer than stock.

I am going to take extensive measurements tonight and just model the whole jeep interior with a person in it so you'll can see.

As far as the cummins...

It turned out pretty good so far, I designed motor mounts and had them laser cut and bent, they worked out nice, I hope to sell some of these mounts when I get them finalized, I was working with Eric at Novak on them, and we were going to work something out, but I think he decided he did not want to deal with 4BT customers haha.

It is a straight pipe 3" exhaust, and is real loud, the motor is stock right now and has crazy torque, i cant wait to put a bigger turbo on it and some injectors and turn the fuel pump up.

It is really fun to drive, and turns heads like crazy
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Jeep 1:Used to have a 93 YJ 2.5l- 3.5" Black Diamond, Chevy TBI 5.7l V8, SM 465 4 speed, 8.8 rear( 4.10, L/S), rhinoline, Mile Marker 9000, NP 231, Had to sell it due to college
Jeep 2: 89/91 YJ, 4BT Cummins, NV4500, NP 231, Old Man Emu 2.5" suspension lift, 1" body lift.....Runs and drives, but very much a project
Interned at Novak Conversions 2 summers ago

Ask me about my 4BT Cummins Motor Mounts!!
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Unread 10-06-2011, 11:08 AM   #23
youngjeeper11
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o, and just be patient on the panic bar, I have that worked out in my head as well
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Jeep 1:Used to have a 93 YJ 2.5l- 3.5" Black Diamond, Chevy TBI 5.7l V8, SM 465 4 speed, 8.8 rear( 4.10, L/S), rhinoline, Mile Marker 9000, NP 231, Had to sell it due to college
Jeep 2: 89/91 YJ, 4BT Cummins, NV4500, NP 231, Old Man Emu 2.5" suspension lift, 1" body lift.....Runs and drives, but very much a project
Interned at Novak Conversions 2 summers ago

Ask me about my 4BT Cummins Motor Mounts!!
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Unread 10-06-2011, 06:01 PM   #24
GrantYJ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by youngjeeper11 View Post
How do you figure the guages and controls would be harder to work with? Maybe its hard to really visualize scale in the model, but everything is pushed up and about 6" closer than stock...

...and how are the gauges more difficult to see? thats where they are in 90% of cars, not to mention they are 6" closer than stock...
I apologize for not communicating as well as I could have, we're talking about completely different things. I believe that you have a very good setup for reading the gauges and everyday use. What I was trying to say was that the back of the dash appears to be closed and we agree that you must use aftermarket gauges (which you need access to the back side to install)...

The only way that you could install them is to have a piece of material that the gauges are attached to (I referred to them as panels) and then install the panel into a large opening in your dash (similar to the green dash posted earlier in the thread). When I said that the "gauges, switches, and controls would be much less convenient to work with", it was an attempt to highlight a problem in a diplomatic way (you never know who's going to be sensitive).

I've worked in design and development for over fifteen years. Most of that time has been spent looking over the work of others for errors and working out solutions when they get stuck. I apologize if I'm coming across in a snotty manner, it's definitely not my intention, but I tend to immediately look for flaws whenever a drawing is placed in front of me (by the way, which program are you using? Initially, I thought that it was Inventor, but something seems different).

As for the Cummins, I'd love to drop one in my Jeep. I don't know if I really want to go through the hassels involved, but I definitely envy you on yours. I'll probably end up dropping in either a 302 or a 300 straight six for the sake of ease, but I've done a ton of reading on what you've accomplished... To me, it seems like the 4BT would be a near perfect mix of torque, economy, simplicity, and longevity. Did you buy your engine by itself or go the "buy a bread truck" route? Honestly, the biggest road block for me swapping in a 4BT is the very real possibility that my wife would suffocate me in my sleep with a pillow if I parked a bread truck in our driveway.
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Unread 10-06-2011, 06:06 PM   #25
rkham11
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I built a custom dash for a YJ out of stainless during my senior year in high school.

photos were taken with dash not quite finished


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Unread 10-06-2011, 06:38 PM   #26
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My YJ has a 4BT cummins, I ditched the factory gauges a long time ago, I still don't have a working speedo, just because I am having a hard time finding an electronic speedo that I can calibrate (I have a super short SYE with the electronic sender) as well as a tach that I can set up with a diesel that match each other, and are not stupidly priced

Anyway, keep the ideas coming![/QUOTE]

Have you checked out PACCAR for a tach and speedo? Not sure how spendy they would be, but a place to look at least. I know their speedos are able to be callibrated, and chances are very good to get a "matching" tach. Kenworth/Peterbilt are both PACCAR rigs, so a dealer of one or the other can at least price you a set. Also try a big rig wrecking company, might be cheaper. The gauges might be too big, but the newer rigs have smaller ones. For guage access/installation, you could mimic a big rig there too. Flat panels, hinged on the bottom, opens right up for easy access.
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Unread 10-06-2011, 08:17 PM   #27
superj
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have you thought of angling the hvac panel and everything on the center console towards the driver, like bmw has done since the 70s?


this is from an 91 bmw m3, american. see how everything is pointed towards the driver.


this is hte german base model 316 hvac panel i put in my american spec 325i. everything is still pointed towards the driver and you can change out exactly where you want your stuff to sit by pushing out the panels.


another shot showing the angle it points
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Unread 10-06-2011, 08:17 PM   #28
rkham11
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Autometer guages are badass but expensive. The autometer speedo I installed was easily calibrated for any tire size, or gear ratio.
All I had to do was drive 2 miles, hit the button, and I was done. More accurate than the factory one
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Unread 10-06-2011, 08:19 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superj View Post
have you thought of angling the hvac panel and everything on the center console towards the driver, like bmw has done since the 70s?


this is from an 91 bmw m3, american. see how everything is pointed towards the driver.


this is hte german base model 316 hvac panel i put in my american spec 325i. everything is still pointed towards the driver and you can change out exactly where you want your stuff to sit by pushing out the panels.


another shot showing the angle it points
if you look at the pics i posted, the dash i built has this angle you speak of
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Unread 10-06-2011, 08:25 PM   #30
superj
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doh!!! let me look again
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