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Unread 09-22-2009, 04:08 PM   #1
Fred007
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Rubicon Axles?

Ignoring the spring perch issues, is it possible to put a front axle from a Rubicon in a YJ? I am looking at potential replacements for my D30 front and a friend suggested looking at a Rubicon axle as replacment. Has anyone done this and if so, what are the issues other than the perches and perhaps the shock mounts. Thanks.

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Unread 09-22-2009, 04:20 PM   #2
kirksjeep
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The Rubicon Axle is a drivers side drop, the same width and bolt patterns as the YJ Dana 30. The problem is not the amount of work to put one under a YJ, but good luck finding one, and if you do you will pay a lot for it.
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Unread 09-22-2009, 04:25 PM   #3
Fred007
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Well, i got a quote from Currie for a D44 for the YJ with an ARB locker, about $2600. Granted this has all the right mounts and easy to install, but quite pricey. I have a quote out to a nation wide salvage yard, will see what they come back with.
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Unread 09-22-2009, 05:53 PM   #4
HokieYJ
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I read something over on Pirate4x4 that the Rubi Dana44s are pretty weak because they use D30 outers. For the amount of work it takes to swap out axles, why not throw something a little stronger in there? Maybe a cut down waggy 44.

What size tires are you trying to run?
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Unread 09-22-2009, 05:56 PM   #5
Sidewinder
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i have heard yj d30 is just as strong as a tj d44. it shocked me at first but something you should research first.
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Unread 09-22-2009, 06:45 PM   #6
shaggyjim
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred007 View Post
Ignoring the spring perch issues, is it possible to put a front axle from a Rubicon in a YJ? I am looking at potential replacements for my D30 front and a friend suggested looking at a Rubicon axle as replacment. Has anyone done this and if so, what are the issues other than the perches and perhaps the shock mounts. Thanks.
What is your plan for the Jeep Fred? You can install them if you have the fab skills and the tools I would say go for it! However I wouldn't pay much more then $500 for a complete axle. Much more then that and I would look at going to a waggy 44.
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Unread 09-22-2009, 06:51 PM   #7
Axl Jack
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sidewinder View Post
i have heard yj d30 is just as strong as a tj d44. it shocked me at first but something you should research first.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Axl Jack
Why do you say the TJ D44 front is stronger?
Same shafts as a LP/HP D30.
Same knuckles, brakes, ball joints as a LP/HP D30.
HP D30 R&P is about the same strength as a LP Rubi D44.
HP D30 has better shaft angles.

So, what's the advantage? The only thing I see different is the center diff. I'd MUCH rather build a HP 30 than a Rubie "44". The high pinion more than makes up for the 44s larger carrier bearings.

Just to make this point clear for anyone else that stumbles across this thread.

The high pinion (HP) Dana 30 uses reverse spiral gears. This means that the gears are specifically cut to run in a front axle application and the loads on the gear faces are "optimized". For more detail on what that means pick up a machine design text book at your local library. It's been 6 years since I switched from mechanical engineering to pursue a degree in chemistry so I forget the specifics and don't dare engage in a conversation about this on the specifics.

Anyway, a LP axle drives the gears in the wrong (i.e. weak) direction when used in a front axle application. Some say this is anywhere from 20%-30% weaker than driving the gears in the correct direction.

A reverse spiral gear pair driven in the correct direction are 20%-30% stronger (depending on source cited, metallurgy or specific gears, etc.) than a LP gear set run in the incorrect direction.

Some say the D44 LP is ~20-30% stronger than the D30 LP. A HP D30 would be ~20%-30% stronger than the LP D30.

So, this roughly puts the HP D30 used in a front axle application at a very similar (if not stronger) data point compared to a LP D44 used in a front application.

For most people (note use of word most), the HP D30 is more axle than you will ever need in a front axle. That's not to say the HP D30 doesn't suffer from some more issues compared to a LP D44 (carrier flex leading to diff failure chiefly) but again, very few people will ever encounter that.

In closing, if you really want a D44 up front, you need to get a non-TJ front D44 to really be able to say it has superior strength.
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Unread 09-22-2009, 06:52 PM   #8
Goobersbro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HokieYJ View Post
I read something over on Pirate4x4 that the Rubi Dana44s are pretty weak because they use D30 outers. For the amount of work it takes to swap out axles, why not throw something a little stronger in there? Maybe a cut down waggy 44.

What size tires are you trying to run?
the outers a just as week but... the guts in the pumkin are a lot stronger which is one of the failing points of the 30 and 35.... if you not running larger than 35s the rubi 44s are great axle's if you can get a good deal on them
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Unread 09-22-2009, 07:30 PM   #9
Fred007
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Running 34's now, perhaps 35's in the near future, not sure about 37's somewhere down the road. Sounds like I need to do a little more research on the future direction. My main reason for this is that my D30 just exploded about 1 year after getting rebuilt and no real major wheeling. I think the job was botched from the beginning, the guy that is doing the new gears said the wear pattern on the ring gear looked wrong and was going to write it up for me. That being said, I don't mind (in fact enjoy) doing the fab work like fitting in the 8.8 so looking at the waggy 44 may be a good option. Thanks for all the comments, especially the thread on the HP vs LP axles, that is great information.
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Unread 09-22-2009, 07:45 PM   #10
shaggyjim
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred007 View Post
Running 34's now, perhaps 35's in the near future, not sure about 37's somewhere down the road. Sounds like I need to do a little more research on the future direction. My main reason for this is that my D30 just exploded about 1 year after getting rebuilt and no real major wheeling. I think the job was botched from the beginning, the guy that is doing the new gears said the wear pattern on the ring gear looked wrong and was going to write it up for me. That being said, I don't mind (in fact enjoy) doing the fab work like fitting in the 8.8 so looking at the waggy 44 may be a good option. Thanks for all the comments, especially the thread on the HP vs LP axles, that is great information.
Good deal Fred! If your not sure now I would plan a build able to handle the 37's. Its a drag as I'm sure you know to build twice then change the axle out! If you like you can look at my YJ with full size F150 parts. The HP D44 fits nice under a YJ and would match a 8.8 out of a F150 easy. Good luck!
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Unread 09-22-2009, 08:06 PM   #11
tobias94yj
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I was going to bring up the whole LPD44 and HPD30 issue but that was a good quote. I would not waste the money on a LP D44 if you are doing it just for strength. if you are wanting manual lockouts or matching bolt patterns with another rear axle then I say go for it but I would not consider swapping in another front axle unless it was at least a HP D44.

I would say there was definitely something wrong with their work if you grenaded your D30 that soon
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Unread 09-22-2009, 10:05 PM   #12
paultyler
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Good: The locker is excellent. The outers may be the same as a Dana 30 but they are plenty strong for your application/tire size. Same bolt pattern as the D30. Also you can find this axle for about $1000 if you watch the boards. That obviously includes the locker that comes with it. An ARB alone will cost you that much. You can find them with 4.10 gears which is probably what you have in the rear. So once you cut off the TJ attachments and weld on your perches you are done and it just bolts in. The ring and pinion is much larger than the D30 so the critical part of the assembly is stronger than what you have.

Bad: It is low pinion. This will probably mean that you will need a new driveshaft with a CV joint. At the very least you will need to have the front shaft shortened. When I did this swap I got bad vibrations because of the drivesahaft angle which required a new CV shaft. This increased the cost.
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Unread 10-01-2009, 07:21 PM   #13
Fred007
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Quick update. I took in the D30 to a local 4 wheel shop to get it geared and he thinks the mesh pattern was off on the original install. Said this caused excessive heat and wear and probably caused a tooth to fracture and the whole thing to come unglued. It's now regeared (4.10) and half-way back in the Jeep. I did stop by the place that did the original work, they had no interest in talking with me or defending their work. Said it was not their issue. Now I have an attorney friend writing them a little letter, will see what happens.
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