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Unread 02-27-2001, 06:29 PM   #1
rayray
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Revolvers

Anyone here running revolvers with a SOA. Mine came in today. I'm putting them on for a run this weekend. Then next weekend I'm doing the perches and the flip. I'm just curious what kind of differance should be expected. Or if to even use them on the SOA.

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Unread 02-27-2001, 07:57 PM   #2
Cody_91YJ
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Unless you've got a really stiff SOA,
you probably won't need them.

I've seen them on 2 differant SOA setups.
On one it didn't do much good, because the
springs flexed so much, the shackles didn't
even open...and when they did, it was a
little unstable.
On the other, the SOA was a little bit stiffer, and the shackles did a little good.

I've noticed on most rigs with Revolvers though, that if you put them on the rear, and try steep climbs, your going to get alot
of wheel hop, so you may consider that.

But hey, you've already got them in...I'd
say just slap em on (shouldn't take long)
and take em for a spin...if they don't perform well, sell em off or return em
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Unread 02-28-2001, 11:16 AM   #3
ChadLloyd
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I agree with Cody, and I'm about to do the same thing. I'm basically going to try them with and without and see what difference it makes.

if it comes to using one set I'll probably use them in front because of the reported tendency for the rears to hop on steep climbs (I've never experienced this myself, I've been using them for 1.5 years, but I don't have a lot of steep climbs around here). However, I want to see how it does first - number one because I just want to see, number two because the whole reason I'm going SOA in the first place is to get more flex out of the rear suspension, which does not flex well in my current configuration.

The limiting factor will be shock travel, I'm sure.

My buddy went SOA with more or less the same springs I am going with (stock with full length doubled main leaves), and this combination scored 950 - 1000 on a ramp with no tweaking. What that tells me is that the revolvers might help get even more flex out of those springs, but we'll see what happens.

I'd be very interested to know your progress, keep us posted.

Chad

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Unread 02-28-2001, 11:41 AM   #4
Cody_91YJ
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Chad,

Is your friend getting any binding anywhere??
I'm currenty SUA, but ramp around 1050.
I've done a few things with the suspension
thats helped, but I'd think your friend
should ramp close to 1100 or better.

Your already running Revolvers right??
Could you post a pic if you've got one?
If Revolvers will really add close to 10"
more travel, I may do that instead of SOA
since I already get good travel.


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Unread 02-28-2001, 12:32 PM   #5
rayray
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Well, for starters, I only got one pair and I'm gonna use them on the front first. I figured I would test them out before getting to carried away. BTW, I'm not sure what y'all are paying for them, but I picked mine up for $130 a pair from Sam's Offroad.

I've heard of the wheel hop as well from a few folks. Most of them had it happen when doing the trails in Hot Springs. However, on those trails, it's somewhat hard to keep any rig from experiancing wheel hop. Just how bad is the question.

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Unread 02-28-2001, 08:44 PM   #6
osburn
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My last SOA setup ramped about 1130 with 33s. I have flexier springs now, a bit of body lift and have carved my fenders for the TJ flares too. But with the 35" tires, I don't expect my score to increase a whole lot. I'll see this weekend since they always have a ramp at the TDS Desert Safari.

I have one friend running Revolvers front and rear on his SOA. They work pretty good. But I think the biggest gain is in the SUA setups. I've seen SUA setups with Revolvers come near to flexing like an SOA. I saw one SOA rig running Revolvers at the rock crawling competition in Johnson Valley and he had them pinned up so they couldn't open up. Only because he hadn't run them before the competition and the obstacles were too crazy and he just didn't feel comfortable with them. Saw other Revolvers running there but all the rigs there are flexy and it's hard to say whether they were any sort of advantage or not. Honestly I didn't pay that much attention. The pinned up ones caught my eye so I asked.

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Unread 03-01-2001, 07:37 AM   #7
ChadLloyd
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Picture of my rear flex:



This is about as good as my rear flex gets. My front flexes great, I'm limited only by shock travel. Almost all my flex comes from my front on a ramp. On the trail the rear flexes a lot more and a lot better. Go figure.

I suspect that perhaps our ramp is not the standard 20 degrees. I say this not because my score was nly about 900, but because the best ANYONE has ever done is my buddies SOA which did like 960. This is a well engineered job, and I've always read that SOA YJs using stock springs should easily be able to do 1000. Anyway, mine was almost as good as his, so whatever he was ramping I was slightly less ......

I'm more interested in trail performance, and what I notice there is that because the flex is not even (front to back), the rig is not as stable as it should be. This resulted in a couple of wheel stands which although they made great video for other people I would have rather avoided. My objective is to even out the flex front to rear, this should result in a better ramp score simply because I'm going to do this by increasing rear flex rather than decreasing front flex.

That's the plan, anyway!

[This message has been edited by ChadLloyd (edited March 01, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by ChadLloyd (edited March 01, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by ChadLloyd (edited March 01, 2001).]
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Unread 03-01-2001, 09:15 AM   #8
Cody_91YJ
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and you SOA in that pic, right Chad??
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Unread 03-01-2001, 11:54 AM   #9
rayray
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Here's a little update after cussing for a few hours last night.

First, one problem I have is the fellow I bought the jeep from put a shackle reversal on it. That's all well and good, but the bone heads over at 4WPW that installed it put the fu#$ing thing on backwards! You say backwards?? Yep, the new spring hanger that has a right angle (up warrior SRS) is pointing inward rather that outward. The result? The axle is pushed back a couple of inches. Next, my springs are military wrap. Because of this large eye, the revolver will not go around the eye because of the revolver pin joining it to the swival point. Next, the shackle hangers are in too far, so even if I could get the shackle on, it would be resting on the frame (not good).

Well, after saying fu$# it! I figured I could put'em on the rear. So after puting the wheels back on (jack stands are too small) and then moving to the rear and jacking, removing wheels, and unbolting shackles. I see now that the revolvers won't line up the bolt hole. Ok, by this time I'm in a pissy mood and begin to look a little closer and notice the cross brace on the shackle is hitting the frame and not allowing the holes to line up. Can someone tell me if the sizes are differant for the front and rear? Otherwise I'm gonna bust out the grinder and make'um fit.

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Unread 03-01-2001, 12:13 PM   #10
ChadLloyd
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Quote:
Originally posted by Cody_91YJ:
and you SOA in that pic, right Chad??
NO I am NOT SOA in that picture!

I am in the middle of going SOA at this moment. I am going SOA in response to the lack of rear flex I had with my setup, which was SUA with revolvers. A more accurate description is that I am going SOA to try to get more balance in flex between the front and rear.


The picture is from this summer on a trail we use for rock crawling, and the jeep performed very well but once again most of the flex was coming from the front. This picture is of one of the few moments I had (on a seemingly insignifigant mogul) where the rear seemed to be doing something. I often get this amount of flex from the rear, but only under certain conditions. I'm no suspension expert, but it seems to me that all things being equal you will get your flex from the end which twists the easiest, and on mine that's the front. So typically I don't get a lot of flex out of the rear until the front is close to maxing out. This particular picture is of a moment when for some reason the rear was flexing well by itself, just cuz of the way the rocks were etc etc.


I am going to try my SOA both with and without my revolvers.

In fact I would be SOA at this point right now except that the winter has been so friggen terrible that I can't get my flippin' jeep chipped out of the ice block it's frozen in!

Also coming with this same mod is hi clearance steering.

Chad
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Unread 03-01-2001, 04:51 PM   #11
Cody_91YJ
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LoL.
Well its about 70 degrees here right now, muahahaha

I don't think I'll mess with Revolvers for
the time being. My SUA gets about 1050 rti,
and I'd rather spend the $$$ on an SOA.

What springs you using on your SOA Chad.
Stock?

I'm good to go for an SOA now, just need to
weld perches, but I'm undecided on what
springs I'm gonna use.




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Unread 03-01-2001, 06:45 PM   #12
ChadLloyd
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Well, after a lot of web research, I've found that if you are not looking for lift springs then what most people do is use stock YJ springs with a double main (get another set, cut the ends of the main leafs) with the extra main under the main leaf of each pack, running 6 leaf packs on all 4 corners. Some people run a second number 2 leaf ON TOP of the main leaf to help combat axle wrap, too.

In my case, I got 2 sets of wrangler springs, and 1 just happens to have full length add a leaves, so i am going to use the rear 5 leaf packs on all 4 corners with the full length add a leaves. I'm not going to put a second leaf on top of the mai because my buddy the fabricator can make me a anti wrap bar just like Sam's for like next to nothing..... so there you have it. 6 leaf packs, made up of rear wrangler packs + a full length add a leaf on each corner with an anti wrap bar to control axle wrap.

I'm sticking with my 35 inch SXs for now (might fo to 38 inch SXs when these wear out, haven't decided yet), so I'm aiming for around 6.5 - 7 inches of lift. I will get the other inch (SOA usually nets about 5.5 ~ 6 inches) by making the perches slightly taller.

All of this is going on AFTER i get the hi clearance steering in. Just waiting for the snow to clear.

Chad

[This message has been edited by ChadLloyd (edited March 01, 2001).]
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Unread 03-01-2001, 09:17 PM   #13
osburn
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The best results I've seen for stock YJ springs SOA is without question, using rear packs front and rear with the full-length add-a-leaf in all four packs. Just the rear for a 2.5L. The set I took off of mine when I put Alcans on are now under my son's SOA YJ. I've seen the main leafs used and that just doesn't hold up. I've seen National's add-a-leaf used that was specifically designed for SOA. That's no better than the cut main leaf. I've seen Procomp shorty add-a-leaf used. It broke. On 2 out of 4 springs on one Rubicon trip.

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Unread 03-02-2001, 07:06 AM   #14
ChadLloyd
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Quote:
Originally posted by osburn:
The best results I've seen for stock YJ springs SOA is without question, using rear packs front and rear with the full-length add-a-leaf in all four packs. Just the rear for a 2.5L. The set I took off of mine when I put Alcans on are now under my son's SOA YJ. I've seen the main leafs used and that just doesn't hold up. I've seen National's add-a-leaf used that was specifically designed for SOA. That's no better than the cut main leaf. I've seen Procomp shorty add-a-leaf used. It broke. On 2 out of 4 springs on one Rubicon trip.

Good, so my plan looks like it will work,right?

The full length add a leaves that came in the one pack are of unknown origin (probably some local shop), but very thick. My only worry is that the spring pack will be too stiff.

Chad
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Unread 03-02-2001, 09:07 AM   #15
Cody_91YJ
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I don't think you'll be having to worry about it being to stiff.
If some guys can RTI 1200 with 4" spring SOAs, what your doing shouldn't be bad at all.

about what Osburn said...I've NEVER seen a full 1.5" add-a-leaf hold up long on the trails, no matter the brand. I guess they just aren't made for the flexing SOAs do.

Thats a good idea though, 1 full main leaf...lookings forward to those pictures

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