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Unread 12-11-2013, 10:05 AM   #1
warthog312
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Let's talk about getting the shaft.



OK, for those unfamiliar, I'm closing in on finishing my powertrain swap. See my sig for the build thread, but the long and the short of it is a Ford 302, NP435, and EB Dana 20.

I'm at the point where I need driveshafts. As much as I like Tom Woods (when I called I actually spoke to the Tom himself, super cool cowboy type of guy, sounded like what I imagine the Marlboro Man sounds like) I think I can get away with just coming up with my own solution. I was thinking a junkyard shaft from something that works and have it cut and balanced by a local speed shop for lie $50.

Here's where things get wierd. The front axle is a factory Dana 30, which is getting trussed and has the CAD eliminator now, but I plan on eventually going with chromo 1 piece shafts. So I have to figure out how to get that pinion u-joint to fit the same shaft as the output on the 1968 EB Dana 20.

The rear axle is a Ford 8.8 from an '01 Mountaineer, posi (in retrospect, a mistake) and disc brakes. I have the flange adapt from MORE. I have to make that work with the output from the Dana 20 as well.

My DS lengths are going to be all out of whack now because the powertrain is actually significantly shorter than the factory one. I have a DS from a 70s Ford 250 that is about 10 miles long, which I can cut to size, and a ZJ double cardon slip shaft from a buddy who sold his rig. I have no problem hacking these up to make something work, they were both free, and are otherwise just taking up space.

So how do you all recommend I go about this? Keep hackn' n fabbin'? Or just sack up and call Tom back with some measurments?

Also, what type of shafts should I be looking for here for the front and rear? Slip joint? Double Cardon? Single Cardon? I've read a lot of arguments about one versus the other style. FWIW, the 8.8 is staying with limited slip for the forseeable fututre because of cost, and the 30 is getting a selectable locker.

Thanks everyone, for any more detailed info about the rig, check out the build thread in my sig.


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Unread 12-11-2013, 10:13 AM   #2
NHfireYJ
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Woods = Warranty and a great customer service...
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Unread 12-11-2013, 10:15 AM   #3
superj
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i would try taking the cherokee shaft and getting it cut and balanced. that is my plan when i do my swap
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Unread 12-11-2013, 11:14 AM   #4
ssyj94
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Woods is too proud of his shaft....

I've seen them fail alongside the rest so I went with a local to me shop that builds a bunch of eastcoast ultra4 car shafts for teams like Miller motorsports and TR motorsports. The place is called Axle exchange and they'll ship and can make anything you want for very reasonable prices. I'd suggest a 1350cv rear shaft to handle the v8 without any worries.

For the time it'll take to chop everything up and rebuild everything. If you factor in your time you may aswell just buy new to me. Especially for a front shaft that'll always be spinning and a rear that sees a lot of miles. Problem is it sounds like your set up for 1310 stuff?
What are you looking at for lengths?
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Unread 12-11-2013, 12:02 PM   #5
Mambo_Dave
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Why was posi in th 8.8" a bad idea?

I've got a locally available 8.8" out of an Exploder (haven't bought it yet) that they say has posi and a 3.73, so I was thinking of going for it.
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Unread 12-11-2013, 12:04 PM   #6
warthog312
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ssyj94 View Post
I went with a local to me shop that builds a bunch of eastcoast ultra4 car shafts for teams like Miller motorsports and TR motorsports. The place is called Axle exchange and they'll ship and can make anything you want for very reasonable prices. I'd suggest a 1350cv rear shaft to handle the v8 without any worries.
Yep, I've got a local place that builds shafts for everything from dumptrucks to full out dragsters, they do great work and have an awesome reputation in the area. I'd be most inclined to use them rather than some place that just takes measurments over the phone, at least this way I can trailer my rig over there and have them take a look.



Quote:
Originally Posted by ssyj94 View Post
Problem is it sounds like your set up for 1310 stuff?
Although I haven't confirmed, I have a sinking gut feeling that this the case. I don't know what to do short of having to rip everything apart and change the inputs/outputs on the axles and t-case. That gets me way deeper financially and in time than I think I can overcome to have this rig ready to rock by March and the season openers at the local parks. Moreso financially crippling though.



Quote:
Originally Posted by ssyj94 View Post
What are you looking at for lengths?
Can't say just yet. I decided last night now's the time to begin thinking about it, but I haven't taken "official" measurments yet per se.
EDIT: Much much longer than stock, this is for sure.


What say ye about the differences between single, double cardons, and slips? Which would you think is most appropriate for my front and rear, repectively?
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Unread 12-11-2013, 12:06 PM   #7
warthog312
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mambo_Dave View Post
Why was posi in th 8.8" a bad idea?

I've got a locally available 8.8" out of an Exploder (haven't bought it yet) that they say has posi and a 3.73, so I was thinking of going for it.

It's not necessarily 100% a bad thing, but it limits you to a full case locker. You can't just toss a lunchbox at it, whereas with the open 8.8 you can.

I know that full case lockers are better anyway, and I guess in a way this will prevent me from spending more money in the long run, because I won't buy a selectable then just upgrade to full case later, I'm forced to get the more expensive and better option right off the bat.
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Unread 12-11-2013, 12:45 PM   #8
ssyj94
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Unless much longer means 3' id plan on using a rear cv. I run an atlas with 3" stretch for about 25" shaft and still use a cv. If the tcase is more forward than stock id also run a cv. But it all depends on your lift height and wheelbase. Goin to 1350 is as simple as changing yokes and the companion flange for the 8.8. If you dont have anything silly like srs or revolvers a standard travel shaft will usually work fine.

Theres no need to swap inputs. To figure out what you got just measure the width of the yoke where the joint rides.
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Unread 12-11-2013, 12:55 PM   #9
bgredjeep
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Wouldn't the d30 and d20 both use a standard 1310 joint? I'm running 1310s all around in my YJ w/ no issues.
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Unread 12-11-2013, 03:39 PM   #10
warthog312
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bgredjeep View Post
Wouldn't the d30 and d20 both use a standard 1310 joint? I'm running 1310s all around in my YJ w/ no issues.
Possibly. My fear is that they won't hold my hopped up V8 and 35"+ MTs.
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Unread 12-11-2013, 03:50 PM   #11
jeepguy85
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Just FYI, but my brother in law runs 1350s in all his hot rods. However, you are talking about 600+ hp big block hot rods. Unless you are pushing heavy hp, I would run the 1310s and see how they hold up. Unless you are pushing the skinny peddle through the floor, I would carry a spare u joint before throwing more $$$ at a problem you don't even know you have yet.
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Unread 12-11-2013, 03:54 PM   #12
sardog211
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Finally a topic I can chime in on, skip the junkyard route and get one made somewhere, I did a XJ front CV drive shaft had it cut down, and had vibes at 68 mph, then I did the 8.8 so it was cut down again and now I have vibes at 60 mph. So it has been cut twice at a 100.00 each time, so I have a 200 dollar driveshaft that I cut down 2 times that I can't use at hwy speeds, you can also look at tattons driveshafts on eBay 305.00 with the flange to your door. TW and Tattons are good, there is also a used TW for sale in the classifieds section.
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Unread 12-11-2013, 05:41 PM   #13
PA_YJ19
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Read joe Dillard's thread on xj shaft cutting 101. I cut and sleeve xj shafts with Dom tubing as per his instructions on that thread and have never had an issue. The last 2 didn't even need balanced, took them in and they told me they already were. I have yet to break or bend one this way, just make sure to use dom tubing. I think I spent mayb 40 bucs on each one, doesn't take much tube to sleeve it, usually less than 10 inches. I used 1/4 wall dom, I think it was 2.5 inches in diameter if I remember correctly. Beats paying 300 if u ask me, a warranty is nice tho, I just make an extra n bring it along as a spare. Here is a pic of what the end result looks like


image-2714535987.jpg

Mmmmm beefy haha
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Unread 12-11-2013, 06:50 PM   #14
superj
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Nice
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Unread 12-11-2013, 07:45 PM   #15
bgredjeep
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Quote:
Originally Posted by warthog312 View Post
Possibly. My fear is that they won't hold my hopped up V8 and 35"+ MTs.
It's just a 302... Lol JK

I tend to abuse my jeep and I've bent several driveshafts. Never lost a joint without first smashing the driveshaft. I'm not sure about the ford d20 (mine is a jeep d20) but I'm pretty sure you won't have a CV yoke on either output on that case.
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