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Unread 08-12-2011, 03:24 PM   #1
bigbossd1030
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Chatter

Ok so first off I have been doing searches on this and they dont tell me what I need to know.
I have a chatter in all gears, from what I understand, it is from the flywheel having foreign debris on it such as oil, brake fluid, water, mud etc etc causing it to glaze over.
It is not as noticeable at low RPMS or high RPMS, but at 1700rpm, it is really loud.
So here is my question, what is invovled in removing the flywheel and resurfacing it. Is this something I could do myself during a weekend (its my DD) or should I take it in to someone. Yeah I could get one for between 130 and 200 bucks, but if I can save mine then I would rather do that.
Thanks for any help in advance.
Oh and its a 95YJ, I6 4.0. 5 speed AX15.

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Unread 08-12-2011, 04:39 PM   #2
oldtime_ironman
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Dunno about doing it in a weekend, depends how good you are at wrenching. You basically have to pull out the trans, t-case, and clutch to remove the flywheel.

I tried to "do it myself" on my old cherokee by using a sander and sandpaper. I found out that's a bad idea. Doing it by hand like I tried to you will never get it flat enough. It will end up like a warped brake rotor which eats pads. Only in this case it eats clutches.

So you're way better off to pull the flywheel yourself and take it to a machine shop or engine rebuilder. They'll surface it properly on a machine for a very small nominal charge.
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Unread 08-12-2011, 06:40 PM   #3
dillonjm
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You could do it in a day, easy, if you're anyway proficient with a wrench and have a buddy. The trannies in a Jeep aren't hard to drop. Plan on two if its your first time, or are questioning if you're up for the task.

Definitely have it resurfaced professionally.
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Unread 08-12-2011, 10:43 PM   #4
zeus87gn
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Im confused.
Clutch chatter happens when you are engaging the clutch from a dead stop and the engine/trani shakes somewhat violently.
Do you start at 1700rpm?
Does this chatter happen while moving?
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Unread 08-13-2011, 08:49 AM   #5
bigbossd1030
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeus87gn View Post
Im confused.
Clutch chatter happens when you are engaging the clutch from a dead stop and the engine/trani shakes somewhat violently.
Do you start at 1700rpm?
Does this chatter happen while moving?
No the chatter doesn't happen from a stop, it only happens when I am moving in a gear, its not a shake, it shifts smooth and evenly through gears.
At first I only noticed it when I hit about 1700rpms, when I did my tranny fluid last weekend, I had the shift boot off at the point where I could see the tranny, and I could hear the chatter at all rpms. When I let go of the gas while in gear, it goes away, when I give it gas, it arises. It is at its loudest point when I hit 1700Rpms. I hope that clears things up.
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Unread 08-14-2011, 09:53 AM   #6
zeus87gn
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What you are describing isn't clutch chatter.
You have something internally making noise.
You may want to check your TC and rear drive shaft just so you can eliminate those as causing the problem.
Pay close attention to the condition of the fluid in the TC.
Grease the u-joints if they have fittings.
What was the condition of the fluid you drained from the trani?
What fluid did you put back in your trani?
Has it gotten any quieter since the fluid change?
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Unread 08-15-2011, 08:14 AM   #7
bigbossd1030
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I'm gonna make a video, from all the posts I read it sounds like chatter, I mean if it was a ujoint problem it would vibrate. As for the tranny fluid, ut was a little dark, I put in 80w 90, it was the closest to 75w 90 I could find. No it did not reduce the sound. And like mentioned it was far more noticable with the umm (dog house) off. Once I put that back on, it was reduced and only heard when beside a wall or at 1700rpm. Ill take a gander at the tc fluid.
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Unread 08-15-2011, 09:36 AM   #8
zeus87gn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbossd1030 View Post
I mean if it was a ujoint problem it would vibrate.
Not necessarily. They can make funny noises if they have a comprimised seal and have leaked a little grease. I have heard them squeak at slow speeds when they ride just fine at speed. I wouldnt put it past one of them to make funny noises at odd rpms. Stranger things have happened.

Dark trani fluid is not a big deal as long as you didn't see any metal pieces in it.
A fine shiny dust mixed in the fluid can be normal - kinda depends on how long that fluid has been in there and how it's driven.

Is this noise continuous or does it pulsate?
Does it change with engine rpm or speed on the road?
When you had the boot off, did you hear this noise if you were sitting still in neutral?

I know it's difficult to descripbe things in type, just trying to get a clear understanding.
Since I was 16, clutch chatter has always been as I described it previously. What you are describing doesn't fit in my mind as clutch chatter.
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Unread 08-15-2011, 10:03 AM   #9
kahanabob
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeus87gn View Post
Im confused.
Clutch chatter happens when you are engaging the clutch from a dead stop and the engine/trani shakes somewhat violently.
Do you start at 1700rpm?
Does this chatter happen while moving?
Good catch!!
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Unread 08-15-2011, 03:23 PM   #10
bigbossd1030
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So it might be a ujoint... the noise does change with rpm, only acceleration, when I reach my speed and level out it goes away, but if I level out my speed at 1700 rpm like at 80km I can hear it. And also during down shifting its not noticable at all. I cannot here it in neutral or when coasting in gear with the clutch pedal pressed, that's why I think its my clutch. I tried to get a vid, but you know how noisey these thimgs are, couldn't get a clear chatter.
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Unread 08-17-2011, 09:37 AM   #11
bigbossd1030
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Nobody hey? Well I went under yesterday and all my ujoints look fine, I also had my bro (mechanic) look too and he said they are fine. So I'm pretty sure its my clutch, I am would just like to know forsure before I drop god knows how much money into this thing.
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Unread 08-17-2011, 09:42 AM   #12
zeus87gn
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Good that the U-joints are Ok.
Have you taken your mechanic friend for a ride to listen to this?

Real difficult to diagnose over the interwebs.
I'll still put my money on something internal to the trani, TC or maybe the rear differential.

Good Luck!
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Unread 08-17-2011, 10:12 AM   #13
oldtime_ironman
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If it happens at 1700 RPM regardless of what gear, then my bet is on the clutch/flywheel needs surfacing. Since all the U-joints checked out. Because think about it, that's where the engine makes the most torque, so that's where its gonna slip.

If it was something like out of balance on the drivetrain, then it would change with speed, not RPM.

.
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Unread 08-17-2011, 10:14 AM   #14
zeus87gn
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You're thinking it's slipping at that rpm?
I've never had that happen to me.
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Unread 08-17-2011, 01:08 PM   #15
bigbossd1030
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The mechanic is my brother lol, he is always in the jeep with me. And I lean away from the ujoints as they seem ok and all noise stops 100% when I press the clutch pedal in. It makes the chatter at all speeds in all gears and is loudest at 1700 rpms. I'm gonna take it in and get the flywheel resurfaced if not a new one. I'm going to try and get a vid again after work, its hard. Thanks for all the help and ill post if it fixes it, oh and its not really slipping, it has good pickup even in 5th gear.
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