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Best Setup for Me

1K views 24 replies 9 participants last post by  cyoos 
#1 ·
So as some know, I just bought my first Jeep at the end of the summer. 95 4.0 with the manual 5. I didn't get to enjoy it for long, it ended up parked / in a shop for about a month after I ran into some transmission problems. Rebuilt transmission, new clutch, and a new front drive shaft later I'm rolling again.

There are several nuances about a 21 year old Jeep, mine specifically, that I can live with for now but I'd like to tackle getting it set up the way I want and need. It came with a lot of extras as you can see in the picture. It's a Rough Country lift, I believe 4". 31" M/T tires. I confirmed recently that the stock Dana 30 / Dana 35 are still on it. Haven't had to use 4WD yet but the transmission shop tested it and told me it works fine.

I bought the Jeep as a second vehicle. It's for fun, but it's also to get me to work in the snow. I drive about an hour, mostly highway and main roads. I like the lift and despite how incredibly rough of a ride it is I'll probably keep it. My issue is being set up for snow more than off-roading.

If I can survive running open diff's front and rear I'm ok with that. I've read running a locker in front is a bad idea but people do it anyway so I'm not entirely sure why a lunchbox type option wouldn't be helpful in bad weather. My daily driver torque steers like a mother so I'm no stranger to taking corrective action upon throttle input. I've also tossed around the idea of doing an 8.8 rear so that there is an LSD in the back.

I guess I've read a lot online and it's kind of all over the place. Is it worth replacing the Dana 35 if I'm not going to run tires larger than 31" and won't be going into deep mud? Are the tires a bad choice for on-road ****ty driving conditions? I just want the most capable on-road Jeep I can get and with that I'm sure I can handle whatever off-roading I do in the future.

Thanks!
 

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#2 ·
The rough ride? Rough Country springs.
Very stiff spring rates.
They're cheap so people buy them. You can have a lift that rides so much better. When (not if) the time comes, we'll discuss it.

Mud style tires are not good snow/ice tires. Small contact patch with minimal siping.

Lockers in snow/ice:
The only locker I would use is selectable. And it wouldn't be on on ice.
When 2 or 4 wheels spin, they immediately drift the way the road is crowned.
The best the Jeep will do in winter conditions is open diffs with winter tread style tires. Tires with lots of small grooves.
The only exception would be a monumental dump with 2 feet+ of snow, lockers may help some in that situation.

To be honest, a Jeep would not be my first choice as a foul weather machine. Light weight, short wheelbase, prone to rust.

Advise from a desert dweller?
(I'm from the mountains of Colorado and fed up with bad weather)

Back in Colorado, the Jeep was parked all winter and I drove a Subaru.
It would drag itself through hood deep powder...

The Dana 30/35 should be fine for 31" tires.
They would be way down "the list"
 
#3 ·
I'm sure the RC shocks aren't helping that ride either...

I second that the Jeep won't be great in the snow due to it being light, short and somewhat wide tires, but open open with a set of snow tires is your best bet. Your Dana 30/35 combo should be totally fine for what you are doing. I haven't blown up my Dana 35 with 33's and a stroker yet, but I also don't beat on it that hard.

If you want to drive it in the snow then open open, snow tires, and take it slow and you should be fine. Dont expect to do 55 in adverse conditions though. More like 35. The short wheelbase and light weight will definitely limit your speed. My Jeep used to spin right around like it had no cares in the world if I wen't much over 30 in the snow. My XJ on the other hand is a total champ in the snow using the same tires. I contribute a lot of that to weight and wheelbase, as I carry a lot more extra weight in the XJ and the wheelbase is about 8" longer on the same width axles.
 
#4 ·
I will say, the Jeep is very very good when it is very very snowy. The more snow, the better it is.

The jeep is the worst in the thin layers of slush and slight snow. When there is a possibility of digging down to pavement with a real snow tire, you'll see all sorts of other smaller cars doing better than a jeep with mud terrains. When the snow is super deep, they'll call you to come pull them out of the snow banks though.
 
#5 ·
That's been my experience so far. I've taken the Jeep to work when they call for snow. We get 1-2" and then I'm all over the place. Definitely gotten her sideways taking turns too fast.

Maybe the answer to my question is, I'm set. Small snowfalls I take the car, 6-8"+ I take the Jeep. I'm NW of Philadelphia so the big snowfalls are only once or twice a year.

For light trail duty (not rock crawling or mud bogging) is the open / open set up with M/T's sufficient or should I look into a front locker at that point? I'll do occasional trail driving when it warms up but nothing crazy.
 
#6 ·
You can go quite a ways with just open open if you are smart about wheel placement. You can also use you emergency brake as a traction aid, adding some resistance to a rear wheel that might be in the air, transferring some power back to the wheel on the ground. I can't speak for having a front locker in the snow as I don't have one. I can say that my rear locker definitely makes a big difference offroad. It is definitely noticeable on the street though when conditions get slick. It has yet to bite me, but it's an adjustment. I have an aussie locker in the rear, the clicking doesn't bother me and the off road traction is well worth it. I DD my Jeep and take it offroad 1-2 times per month, year round. Almost every weekend in the summer. This is all in my XJ, although the drivetrain is almost identical to your YJ. My YJ went a lot of places open open. I have an 8.8 limited slip going in it now but haven't driven it yet so I can not speak for that either. LDS may be a better bet for something that is more street and less off road though. It also should help your on road performance.
 
#9 ·
Definitely do this!

Rally racers used to use rear wheel drive predominantly up until about the early 90's and they either stay on the track or die in a firey ball of death against a wall made of spectators.

If you are used to front wheel drive or all wheel drive, you need to get used to RWD oversteer and how to correct it. Front wheel drives almost always understeer, and the correction to that is to slow down with ABS (or use handbrake to induce oversteer then correct if you are racing). With a rear wheel drive, the correction for oversteer is almost never to press the brakes. you need to continue the skid smoothly into recovery. Look way out into the distant road and keep the wheel in the direction you want to ultimately drive in. Example, if your rear end is sliding to the right, you're going to turn the steering wheel slightly to the right to keep your front wheels pointed in the direction you want to continue driving while very slowly easing off the throttle.

You need to get a feel for when and how much the vehicle will oversteer. Rally racers know this, and that's how they enduce their oversteer before a corner to start drifting around it. you shouldn't be doing that, but you should develop that same level of feel for when it will happen, how to continue it, and how to stop it.

In the Norwegian countries, they will intentionally ice the roads (parking lot) with sprinklers and induce spinouts so you can show your competency in spin recovery during your driver license exam! Honestly, I think we could REALLY use that sort of tougher driving exam in the United States.
 
#10 ·
I'm not going to pretend to be an expert but I'm pretty adept at driving different types of vehicles. My daily is turbo'd and FWD, understeer / torque steer and I get along great. However, the first snowfall I took the Jeep out and got almost completely sideways at 30MPH. I got out of it just fine but it was a little eye opening. It's a bit of transition going back and forth but I guess I didnt' realize how light and tail happy the jeep was, especially in slick conditions on mud tires. Slow and steady.

I suppose the best course of action would be to get some A/T or snow tires for the winter and keep the mud tires just in case. I may try to survive the winter as-is and plan for the next winter season. Doesn't sound like an 8.8 is at all necessary for what I plan on using the Jeep for and lockers will just add to the fight to keep her straight.

Sooo about those RC springs....
 
#13 ·
I would definitely try and get some A/Ts or snow tires for the winter. Mud terrains are great in the mud, but everywhere else they are awful. My buddy has a bone stock wrangler on street tires (like 27s, tiny) but just bought a new one. His new one has 32" mus terrains, and it is awful onroad in the snow. He had driven his old jeep woth stock tires and never had a big problem with spinninh out on the road, but the second snowfall of the year in his new jeep he spun out and hit the median. Happened so fast that by the time he had time to react he was in the wall. Lucky it wasnt totaled (any other car would've been) but he did rip the mounting point for the bumper on the front part of the frame. The next snowfall he test drove both jeeps and his jeep with the M/ts was all over the place and needed 4wd when his street tires were firmly planted the road and didnt need 4wd

My point is, i would highly recommend snow tires. Snow tires will be night and day difference. A/ts would be fine, but snow tires are much better and you can swap your MTs on in the summer
 
#11 ·
Ezekiel81923 said:
I'm not going to pretend to be an expert but I'm pretty adept at driving different types of vehicles. My daily is turbo'd and FWD, understeer / torque steer and I get along great. However, the first snowfall I took the Jeep out and got almost completely sideways at 30MPH. I got out of it just fine but it was a little eye opening. It's a bit of transition going back and forth but I guess I didnt' realize how light and tail happy the jeep was, especially in slick conditions on mud tires. Slow and steady. I suppose the best course of action would be to get some A/T or snow tires for the winter and keep the mud tires just in case. I may try to survive the winter as-is and plan for the next winter season. Doesn't sound like an 8.8 is at all necessary for what I plan on using the Jeep for and lockers will just add to the fight to keep her straight. Sooo about those RC springs....
I would get something other than them, I had old man emu and currently have bds. They ride damn near the same. But old man emu did flex more than the bds springs.when I switched to bds I actually lost some height. (Half an inch at most) but all in all its not too bad. Bds has a great warranty. So when I need new springs I'll probably get bds again.
 
#12 ·
I have Old Man Emu and Rubicon Express.
Old Man Emu ride the best out of all the springs I have been around.
The flex is very good. It's rare for me to have a wheel in the air.

I recently modified the Rubicon Express springs and they are also soft.
They came with 2 main leafs. One of the mains was a military wrap. I removed the military wrap spring so the pack now has just one main leaf.
MUCH BETTER!
Went from an intolerable buckboard to a pretty darn good ride.

Shocks are also VERY important to ride quality. I believe the ones you have (RC) are improperly valved.
Kind of a one size fits all which end up fitting none...

Lets talk more about how you will use the Jeep besides a foul weather commuter.
 
#14 ·
Lots of great recommendations here with tires, suspension, testing in an icy parking lot and vehicle choice.

As far as lunchbox lockers go, We don't recommend driving at highway speeds, in 4WD, in Icy conditions with a front locker. Around town is just fine, but be aware you will experience some understeer, which means the vehicle will try to drive straight through a turn. You can anticipate the understeer and adjust your driving accordingly. If you want to run front and rear lockers, in the winter conditions leave the vehicle in 2WD unless you really need 4WD, you will be surprised how much the rear locker helps, you won't need 4WD as often. If you are just looking for a rear locker, that should help in the winter conditions, just get used to how it will act with your short wheelbase and light vehicle.

~Cora
 
#15 ·
@aussielocker...

Cora,

How would the aussie affect on road driving if 4wd was engaged at the transfer case, but the CAD was disengaged allowing the passenger axle to spin freely?
I've been wondering about this before setting up a front axle with a one piece, and this thread seems relevant to the question.

Thanks,

Chris
 
#16 ·
HI Chris!

Well you shouldn't be running around in 4WD with a front locker on pavement, very bad for the u-joints, strains the drivetrain.
On the trails, if are in 4WD and disengage the CAD system, one front wheel will get torque the other will not... some refer to this as the poor man's selectable locker. You can disengage the CAD system when you need to make a tight turn, this will decrease your turning radius to something similar to an open differential. I would keep the CAD system engaged most of the time on the trails though, only disengage for tight turns.
 
#17 ·
@aussielocker

Thanks Cora.

I didn't mean to hijack the thread, but I literally have thousands of miles on snowy/slushy/icy highways in my YJ with open/open, and this seems relevant to the OP's original post.

...I bought the Jeep as a second vehicle. It's for fun, but it's also to get me to work in the snow. I drive about an hour, mostly highway and main roads. ...

... I've also tossed around the idea of doing an 8.8 rear so that there is an LSD in the back. whatever off-roading I do in the future. ...
Like everyone else will attest to, the SWB Jeeps will cross up in a heartbeat. I only used 4WD in spots where the conditions were the worst, and am getting an 8.8 LSD ready for the rear. But I've been debating between True-Trac with one piece axle or an aussie with a cable actuated CAD for the front before I start getting back into off-roading.

I've heard it called a poor man's selectable locker a lot of times, and I was curious about how it would affect situations out on the road in really slick shtuff when you're going about 35 to 40 with it in 4WD. With the open/open It actually seemed to help a bit, to me, to use the 4WD during those times.

(Edit: I found the slick spots in 2WD, and only went to 4WD after it was straightened out again. Then when the roads seemed to clear up a bit I went back to 2WD.)

So my main curiosity is that by having the 4WD engaged with the aussie but the CAD disengaged, wouldn't the passenger side tire act as something of an anchor (hypothetically) to help the front stay on track?

Maybe I'm going to be surprised by the amount of extra traction the rear LSD will give me and no longer feel the need to use 4WD at those times, and maybe I'll have to re-learn my on-road habits. Then again, maybe I'm getting too old for the crap and should just get a Subaru for those times. :laugh:
 
#21 ·
Mazdaspeed3. It's modified and tuned. No lightning fast race car but at full throttle on bumpy roads it pulls you all different kinds of directions.

As practical as a hatchback CAN be it doesn't have copious amounts of room. There's no bench in the back of the jeep so it has more room for random **** whenever I need to transport things around which is another plus.
 
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#23 ·
You might want to check out the reviews for Bridgestone Blizzak's or Michelin X-Ice series tires. The Blizzak's sound like they're really good. Both brands are pricey, but it's still a "you get what you pay for" situation.
 
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