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Unread 04-17-2011, 10:32 PM   #1
MrPoot
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Best Diesel swap options

Howdy folks,
I have pretty much decided to go ahead with a diesel swap to replace my 2.5L and AX-5. So, I am trying to get a list of diesel engine options to choose from. I have seen a few various write-ups but information is less than consistant regarding these swaps. So far, 4BT paired with an nv4500 seems the best choice, but I really dont know what benefits the other diesel swaps may have. A lot of the guys say the 4BT is too heavy, while at the same time I've seen a few writeups on 6BT swaps even.
The main advntages I'm looking for is the huge increase in torque followed by way improved fuel economy. I don't want to sacrifice all off-road capability for 40 mpg by any means (for instance the small merc engines), so I'm looking for a nice compromize. 6BT seems pointless to me since its so heavy and I dont ever do much of any towing.
I appreciate any input y'all may have, thanks in advance.

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Unread 04-17-2011, 10:52 PM   #2
superduty59
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A 4BT is great, a little heavy but great. A Cummins 3.3 a smaller lighter 4cyl is another popular swap in Jeeps. I think you can get a brand new 3.3 for under $4000. I am in the middle of a Mercedes 5cyl turbo diesel swap. Not as much power but for me it was priced right at $100.
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Unread 04-18-2011, 06:36 AM   #3
dodger889
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It's not the engine that cost so much as the parts that are added to get everything to work.
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A 89 yj with a 4.0 aw4 sye out of an 92xj. Now the hard part is done time to get it up in the air just a bit. Working on 8.8 with 3.73 and lsd for the rear. and new D30 hp with 3.73 .
For those who have not figured this out I'm old school but can handle the new too.
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Originally Posted by bigsquat View Post
im just cheap, and cheap makes you creative.
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Unread 04-19-2011, 07:04 AM   #4
superduty59
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For me I bought a whole Mercedes 300sd for $100. From the engine back is all jeep making parts easy and cheaper to find. I bought a bellhousing/flywheel adapter for $350. An AX-15 and T-case to swap out my BA-10 and T-case for $250. So for an almost rust free 88 YJ and a swapped turbo diesel, I have less than $1500 total including the YJ.

Most similar swaps will be the same. An adapter plate and if there are clearance maybe a 4" lift. If you beat on it then maybe a NV4500 and an Atlas 2. It can get very expensive if you are extreme and beat on everything.
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Unread 04-19-2011, 09:40 AM   #5
vetteman9368
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superduty59 View Post
For me I bought a whole Mercedes 300sd for $100. From the engine back is all jeep making parts easy and cheaper to find. I bought a bellhousing/flywheel adapter for $350. An AX-15 and T-case to swap out my BA-10 and T-case for $250. So for an almost rust free 88 YJ and a swapped turbo diesel, I have less than $1500 total including the YJ.

Most similar swaps will be the same. An adapter plate and if there are clearance maybe a 4" lift. If you beat on it then maybe a NV4500 and an Atlas 2. It can get very expensive if you are extreme and beat on everything.
it will be interesting to know how it does and what kind of fuel economy it gets
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Unread 04-19-2011, 12:09 PM   #6
mdubs
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The Isuzu 4BD1T is also an option. Essentially a japanese version of the 4BT.

It is a smidge heavier than the 4BT but puts out very comparable numbers. It seems to be a little easier to find for a decent price (at least in my area). They were used in the Isuzu box trucks up through '99 I believe. After that, they used another 4 cyl diesel but it got much heavier and had electronics for the fuel delivery.

Hope that helps a little. Do us all a favor and put together a good write up when you get going on this.
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Unread 04-19-2011, 12:24 PM   #7
mdubs
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Another note.

The NV4500 is a great transmission but it is also ridiculously long (~19") compared to the AX15 (16.5"). This can start to create drivetrain nightmares very quickly.

If a rear stretch is in your plans, then don't fret but just make sure that you take all of this into account.

Some will call for my crucifixion for this but here goes; you don't need to have an overdrive transmission for all applications.

Yes, diesels don't have a huge rpm range but combined with proper gearing and larger tires, a really tough 4 speed transmission like the SM420 or the SM465 can be used. The SM420 actually has a larger gearing range than the NV4500 as well. They are lighter, shorter (~12") and considerably cheaper than the NV4500 as well.

If your plans don't include gearing and tire changes, please disregard this post
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Unread 04-19-2011, 12:25 PM   #8
dodger889
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superduty59 View Post
For me I bought a whole Mercedes 300sd for $100. From the engine back is all jeep making parts easy and cheaper to find. I bought a bellhousing/flywheel adapter for $350. An AX-15 and T-case to swap out my BA-10 and T-case for $250. So for an almost rust free 88 YJ and a swapped turbo diesel, I have less than $1500 total including the YJ.

Most similar swaps will be the same. An adapter plate and if there are clearance maybe a 4" lift. If you beat on it then maybe a NV4500 and an Atlas 2. It can get very expensive if you are extreme and beat on everything.
Do you have it finished? If not you can add about another $500 to1000 to complete the install and have it running down the road. It's those little things (bolts and nut, wiring, relays, fuel lines/ pump and mounting brackets) that add up quick not the big parts.
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A 89 yj with a 4.0 aw4 sye out of an 92xj. Now the hard part is done time to get it up in the air just a bit. Working on 8.8 with 3.73 and lsd for the rear. and new D30 hp with 3.73 .
For those who have not figured this out I'm old school but can handle the new too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigsquat View Post
im just cheap, and cheap makes you creative.
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Unread 04-20-2011, 07:36 PM   #9
superduty59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dodger889 View Post
Do you have it finished? If not you can add about another $500 to1000 to complete the install and have it running down the road. It's those little things (bolts and nut, wiring, relays, fuel lines/ pump and mounting brackets) that add up quick not the big parts.
I am not finished yet but I have everything I need except for oil and fuel filters, oil and valve cover gasket. I am re-using everything good no need to by new. I have all the bolts and nuts after tearing apart a whole Mercedes. I am splicing the Mercedes glow plug circuit into the Jeeps harness with built in relays. Everything from the flywheel back is all Jeep including flywheel, clutch, fuel lines, gas (now diesel) tank. I literally pulled out one engine and replaced it with another. Almost now real big modification.

This is not my first rodeo, I have done other swaps and I plan ahead and research others doing similar swaps so there is no big suprises. This swap is not uncommon. It has been done at least 20-25 that I'm aware of.
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Unread 04-20-2011, 09:09 PM   #10
yjcrawlr
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One of my friends is dropping a om617 mated to a 700r4 in his yj right now. probably the biggest issue is the oil pan that sits right in front. He's going to stretch the wheelbase to help it out. Here's a pic.

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Unread 04-20-2011, 11:40 PM   #11
linusb
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I think I've read that the 4BT vibrates like mad.
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Unread 04-21-2011, 09:16 AM   #12
weerwolv
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Hi all

I've done a lot of research on this type of swap over the years and the consensus of that research is as follows:

1.) 6BT-Way too heavy unless one wants to reinforce the frame, drop 3/4 ton axles on their rig. The weight of the engine alone is plus 1000 pounds

2.) 4BT-The little brother to the 6BT; found in bread trucks and generators all the type. Fits much better than 6BT but shakes likes a demon unless mounted on fluid mounts and is a noisy little sucker. Weighs around 750 lbs

3.) GM 6.2 or 6.5 V8 Diesels-Tons of them out there for good or bad. Not that difficult a swap as they utilize GM mounts and conversions. They run hot though so a radiator swap will be needed. Here is a fellow who threw one in his Wrangler

http://www.thedieselpage.com/readers/fleming.htm


4.) As some here have already mentioned the Mercedes OM617 swap is gaining popularity due to size and weight. In fact, I've recently come across a fellow making the motor mounts and adapters to throw this in a YJ plus a lot of the technical info. Check him out here:

http://mercedesdiesel4x4.com/default.aspx
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Unread 04-22-2011, 07:56 AM   #13
superduty59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by weerwolv View Post
Hi all

I've done a lot of research on this type of swap over the years and the consensus of that research is as follows:

1.) 6BT-Way too heavy unless one wants to reinforce the frame, drop 3/4 ton axles on their rig. The weight of the engine alone is plus 1000 pounds

2.) 4BT-The little brother to the 6BT; found in bread trucks and generators all the type. Fits much better than 6BT but shakes likes a demon unless mounted on fluid mounts and is a noisy little sucker. Weighs around 750 lbs

3.) GM 6.2 or 6.5 V8 Diesels-Tons of them out there for good or bad. Not that difficult a swap as they utilize GM mounts and conversions. They run hot though so a radiator swap will be needed. Here is a fellow who threw one in his Wrangler

http://www.thedieselpage.com/readers/fleming.htm


4.) As some here have already mentioned the Mercedes OM617 swap is gaining popularity due to size and weight. In fact, I've recently come across a fellow making the motor mounts and adapters to throw this in a YJ plus a lot of the technical info. Check him out here:

http://mercedesdiesel4x4.com/default.aspx
1) It has been done but in my opinion it's too big and heavy!
2) Love a shaking 3.9 4BT but gaining popularity and the prices are going through the roof!
3) Is a great idea. Most think the (Detroit Diesel designed) 6.2 and 6.5 are slow boat anchors but I like them. They have some power, are cheap and easy to find, parts are cheap and bolt up to any Chevy bellhousing.
4) Is what I'm doing. I got the whole running 300sd for $100.
5) A Cummins 3.3 It is also expensive unless you are lucky to find a used on. It is lighter and still has power and can be tuned. It's mainly an industrial engine

This is where I got my adapter. You don't have to stretch the frame it's an I5 and the 4.0 is a I6 so the I5 is shorter.

4.) As some here have already mentioned the Mercedes OM617 swap is gaining popularity due to size and weight. In fact, I've recently come across a fellow making the motor mounts and adapters to throw this in a YJ plus a lot of the technical info. Check him out here:

http://mercedesdiesel4x4.com/default.aspx[/QUOTE]
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Unread 04-22-2011, 08:09 AM   #14
rebelsonjeep
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one thing if you wanna make this build easier is not to go with an electronic deisel engine that has common rail injection or heui (hydraulic electronic unit injection) go with something that an inline multiple pump or unit injection because then you don't have to worry about spending more on a brain, wiring harness and all the sensors. good luck on all your guys' builds ! ROLL SOME COAL! xD
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Unread 04-23-2011, 09:27 AM   #15
weerwolv
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Got one more for ya....especially if you've got the cash and want to go Electronic diesel

Check this out

http://www.hpamotorsport.com/tdijeep.htm


Crazy expensive put the parts are everywhere for this thing......


Other than that, I totally agree with SuperDuty59 and rebelsonjeep on choices.

I really think more and more the way to go is the OM617 or GM 6.2

ON the OM617 only issue being the cost to mod the IP for more fuel. It can be done but its tricky for fuel upgrades which boots power big time.

The 6.2/6.5 biggest issue is heat...and lots of it....
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