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Unread 03-07-2014, 11:22 AM   #1
codenameanimal
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1993 YJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Chambersburg, PA
Posts: 19
Ax15 Transmission Removal

Hello all,
I have a 93 yj 4.0 with the ax15 and the internal slave went out. In process of removing the transmission I discovered that the person before me who put in a new clutch stripped the top external star bolt. I have tried to use bolt extractor set made by Irwin but when the extractor grips and I move onto the next portion of trying to take it out even the extractor slips. Other than that I have everything else out and the transmission is just holding on by that one bolt. Also would anyone recommend me doing the clutch while I'm in there it has less than 15,000 miles on it.

image-3496681420.jpg



image-3822079207.jpg

I know the pics are not the best but hopefully it gives an idea.
Thanks for the help

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1993 Jeep Wrangler 4.0 with AX-15 mostly stock with a 2.5" pro comp lift and a 1" Daystar body lift with 30" tires With Dynaflow exhaust, with hard top and Bestop softop, and Bestop replacement seats
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Unread 03-07-2014, 11:27 AM   #2
Jeepsr4me
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Drimel with cutting disc on it and lop that head off. Get the rest out when the trans comes down
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Unread 03-07-2014, 11:51 AM   #3
Opihi59
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Miserable situation to be stuck in. I was given an AX15 still connected to the bell, PO had to saw across part of the bell to get one of those loose. It is hard to reach that spot to be able to bring much force onto it to adequately hammer on one of those extractors that gouges into the head, then bites deeper and locks in when you twist it off. Having been removed before, it is likely less tight than the ones that have never been removed. Honestly, I believe those hammer on extractors are the best but you can't hammer them on adequately with a ratchet extension. Get it on that way or started, then take off the extension and find some sort of long dowel rod as a punch to drive it in hard, then apply torque to it "squarely" so it will seat, and not ride off on one side. You can drop the rear end of your transmission way down and this will give you more exposure, just watch the radiator fan so it doesn't crush into your radiator as you drop the back end of the trans. Having that 1" body lift on your rig is enormously advantageous in this situation as well for access, but the 1" MML could be hurting you some. At this point as you're working on it, put those two fasteners down low BACK on the bell--the ones farthest apart--so you're not just hanging off that one bolt.
If you can't get it loose this way AND have a welder, you can put a bolt over that head, puddle weld it in place, and get it off that way but admittedly it is very hard to get access to do that, especially trying to do it with a helmet and not just your eyes closed. The dremel with a cut off wheel can work, but again, it's tedious, hard to reach but this could also work.
If your clutch is good, no reason to replace it, just put a dab more lube on your pilot bearing, and put in a new internal slave, but a warning here: these things have a history of failing frequently VERY fast, and Jeepers on here have had them be bad straight out of the box. Try your hardest here to go OEM, this is the place to spend the money and not try to skimp or buy cheaper. Another option is to convert to external slave which is exactly what I did to my 93. The external slave is always easier to service, and the swap is a direct bolt in. Parts needed--external slave version 94 and newer AX15 equipped Jeeps up to 1999, clutch fork and any related spring clip, long snout version front bearing retainer to replace your flat faced front bearing retainer, 94 style throwout bearing, and of course the new external slave itself. You won't regret the effort. Parts available on ebay, local craigslist, local junk yard, etc. Good luck and let us know how it turns out. If you destroy your bellhousing, I can send you a replacement at no cost but mailing, however it is coming from Hawaii.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian4.2 View Post
We will be going Metric every inch of the way.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 40dog View Post
yes I'm a some guy and have always put gasket sealer on my surfaces before mating
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virjeep View Post
You should go to Pirate. I hear they are real smart over there. You'd fit right in.
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Unread 03-07-2014, 11:57 AM   #4
Jeepsr4me
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For some reason those bolts are super tight. I pulled whole engine and trans, and still had trouble with perfect access to those bolts. And WHY did jeep use those crappy bolt star heads? I just did the drimel cut off last week and it works well. You will have to lower the rear of trans to get your arm up there. But it will save you a lot of messing around with that extractor.
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Unread 03-07-2014, 12:33 PM   #5
JCashen
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1990 YJ Wrangler 
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
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I had the same issue when I had to pull my transmission for rebuild. I bought a socket from Walmart "gator socket" or something of the sort. 3/4" socket with pins that fill the inside, when you put it on a bolt the pins push in and form around the stripped bolt.
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Unread 03-07-2014, 12:57 PM   #6
codenameanimal
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Opihi59
Miserable situation to be stuck in. I was given an AX15 still connected to the bell, PO had to saw across part of the bell to get one of those loose. It is hard to reach that spot to be able to bring much force onto it to adequately hammer on one of those extractors that gouges into the head, then bites deeper and locks in when you twist it off. Having been removed before, it is likely less tight than the ones that have never been removed. Honestly, I believe those hammer on extractors are the best but you can't hammer them on adequately with a ratchet extension. Get it on that way or started, then take off the extension and find some sort of long dowel rod as a punch to drive it in hard, then apply torque to it "squarely" so it will seat, and not ride off on one side. You can drop the rear end of your transmission way down and this will give you more exposure, just watch the radiator fan so it doesn't crush into your radiator as you drop the back end of the trans. Having that 1" body lift on your rig is enormously advantageous in this situation as well for access, but the 1" MML could be hurting you some. At this point as you're working on it, put those two fasteners down low BACK on the bell--the ones farthest apart--so you're not just hanging off that one bolt. If you can't get it loose this way AND have a welder, you can put a bolt over that head, puddle weld it in place, and get it off that way but admittedly it is very hard to get access to do that, especially trying to do it with a helmet and not just your eyes closed. The dremel with a cut off wheel can work, but again, it's tedious, hard to reach but this could also work. If your clutch is good, no reason to replace it, just put a dab more lube on your pilot bearing, and put in a new internal slave, but a warning here: these things have a history of failing frequently VERY fast, and Jeepers on here have had them be bad straight out of the box. Try your hardest here to go OEM, this is the place to spend the money and not try to skimp or buy cheaper. Another option is to convert to external slave which is exactly what I did to my 93. The external slave is always easier to service, and the swap is a direct bolt in. Parts needed--external slave version 94 and newer AX15 equipped Jeeps up to 1999, clutch fork and any related spring clip, long snout version front bearing retainer to replace your flat faced front bearing retainer, 94 style throwout bearing, and of course the new external slave itself. You won't regret the effort. Parts available on ebay, local craigslist, local junk yard, etc. Good luck and let us know how it turns out. If you destroy your bellhousing, I can send you a replacement at no cost but mailing, however it is coming from Hawaii.
Thank you for the info I will try the center punch idea first since I don't have access to a welder and then the dremmel if it doesn't work out. As for the the external swap I was considering but the internal I purchased is oem and the one I'm replacing is still the original one according to the previous owner at 181,000 and it only took me 20 minutes to get this far on the transmission removal. Another question for you what do you think about using an air chisel I was thinking it would be too powerful and could do some cracking on the bell housing if not do worse damage?
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1993 Jeep Wrangler 4.0 with AX-15 mostly stock with a 2.5" pro comp lift and a 1" Daystar body lift with 30" tires With Dynaflow exhaust, with hard top and Bestop softop, and Bestop replacement seats
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Unread 03-07-2014, 01:12 PM   #7
Opihi59
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I'm not sure an air chisel would be too advantageous here, but you do need to get the bolt extractor on square, and then torque the bold loose keeping the unit square, otherwise these things will just twist off on one side and you get no where. If you have to, use one of those universal joint things to keep the torque action square. Maybe not an air chisel, but if you have an air impact wrench........that may be the trick.

And of course, replace those E12 torx monstrosities with proper size/pitch/length hex head bolts. Only a few bucks.

Pretty amazing the int. slave lasted 21 yrs/180K miles. But the PO didn't replace it when he did the clutch job 15K miles ago?? Odd. It just seems like an incomplete job........"I rebuilt my engine but didn't bother to put in new main journal bearings"....... Wait, what?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian4.2 View Post
We will be going Metric every inch of the way.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 40dog View Post
yes I'm a some guy and have always put gasket sealer on my surfaces before mating
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virjeep View Post
You should go to Pirate. I hear they are real smart over there. You'd fit right in.
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Unread 03-07-2014, 01:14 PM   #8
Mark05059
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Location: quechee Vermont
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air chisel will break the bell housing... find a socket that you can hammer on there (use a bunch of extentions to get where you can hit it) Use the cheapest socket you can since they usually stretch the most.. when you do get that bolt out of there throw it as far as you can.
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Unread 03-07-2014, 06:49 PM   #9
Stokes_
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Irwin makes terrible tools, spend the money and get Snap On, you're buying great tools and the warranty is for life.
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Unread 03-07-2014, 08:30 PM   #10
Bigev
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stokes_ View Post
Irwin makes terrible tools, spend the money and get Snap On, you're buying great tools and the warranty is for life.
Not everybody can afford snap on. I own them, and I worked with other mechanics who were only craftsman guys.

Guess it depends on how much your willing to spend for quality.
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Unread 03-07-2014, 08:35 PM   #11
codenameanimal
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Location: Chambersburg, PA
Posts: 19
Quote:
Originally Posted by Opihi59
I'm not sure an air chisel would be too advantageous here, but you do need to get the bolt extractor on square, and then torque the bold loose keeping the unit square, otherwise these things will just twist off on one side and you get no where. If you have to, use one of those universal joint things to keep the torque action square. Maybe not an air chisel, but if you have an air impact wrench........that may be the trick. And of course, replace those E12 torx monstrosities with proper size/pitch/length hex head bolts. Only a few bucks. Pretty amazing the int. slave lasted 21 yrs/180K miles. But the PO didn't replace it when he did the clutch job 15K miles ago?? Odd. It just seems like an incomplete job........"I rebuilt my engine but didn't bother to put in new main journal bearings"....... Wait, what?
He told me that he didn't replace the internal because the jeep dealership told him they only get replaced when it goes bad it sounded to me the dealership wanted the extra money to do the same job again I thought it was kind of weird myself but he gave me the paperwork from the clutch work that was done but anyways I will go back at the jeep again tomorrow and see if I can get this stupid bolt. Once I get them out I will take your advice and replace those bolts with hex head versions.
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1993 Jeep Wrangler 4.0 with AX-15 mostly stock with a 2.5" pro comp lift and a 1" Daystar body lift with 30" tires With Dynaflow exhaust, with hard top and Bestop softop, and Bestop replacement seats
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Unread 03-07-2014, 08:38 PM   #12
codenameanimal
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1993 YJ Wrangler 
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stokes_
Irwin makes terrible tools, spend the money and get Snap On, you're buying great tools and the warranty is for life.
I agree snap on are great tools but I like to save my money and use craftsman generally it just seemed that Irwin had the best bolt extractor set that can be bought as a complete set without breaking the bank however once I get out of college maybe I'll look into getting snap on tools
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Unread 03-07-2014, 11:57 PM   #13
Opihi59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by codenameanimal View Post
Once I get them out I will take your advice and replace those bolts with hex head versions.......and throw those 2 evil fasteners fashioned by the devil himself in the closest volcano
Fixed it for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by codenameanimal View Post
He told me that he didn't replace the internal because the jeep dealership told him they only get replaced when it goes bad it sounded to me the dealership wanted the extra money to do the same job again I thought it was kind of weird myself but he gave me the paperwork from the clutch work that was done but anyways I will go back at the jeep again tomorrow and see if I can get this stupid bolt.
I suppose they got away with it, but they didn't get the work back in their shop, so good on ya, mate. It really just seems untidy to not do every part that generally wears in the system, or is totally painful to get to if you have to do it again, all at the same time while you have the system apart. Just my 2 cents on that topic. As far as tools go, I have been slowly buying tools for my entire life. My Dad got tired of me always having his out, so 16th birthday was marked by a pretty great set of Craftsman tools that of course I still am using the crap out of, and adding to as needed over the last 40 years. When you can, buy good tools, and you will find that they will pay for themselves almost the first time you use them. That's the logic I used when I got the welder, and the plasma torch, and the home-made hydraulic press, and the huge air compressor, and the hydraulic garage car-lift........and etc.
Not trying to walk all over your thread but I believe it could now deteriorate into a urine stream challenge over what tools are best. When you can buy the best you can afford and you will not regret it. They will last you a lifetime so long as you don't loan them out, or leave them unguarded.
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Fill out your PROFILE, and don't forget to look in the FAQ for writeups

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian4.2 View Post
We will be going Metric every inch of the way.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 40dog View Post
yes I'm a some guy and have always put gasket sealer on my surfaces before mating
Quote:
Originally Posted by Virjeep View Post
You should go to Pirate. I hear they are real smart over there. You'd fit right in.
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Unread 03-08-2014, 07:02 PM   #14
YJWookiee13
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quickest way would be like previously said, to cut the head of the bolt off... Then remove the transmission and remove studs with remover or vise grips and maybe some heat
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