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Unread 07-31-2013, 03:02 PM   #1
scraper
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95 YJ won't turn over please help

This is for a 95 YJ with a 2.5 stock engine.

I have read through a lot of the posts about this issue and I still need some help. Here is the background. About 4 years ago mice chewed through most of my engine wiring harness. The Jeep then sat for 4 years. This year I decided to get a replacement wiring harness. I did the swap out, it included everything attached directly to the engine wiring harness. Went to start the Jeep and it won't crank at all. Since it sat for 4 years I decided to go ahead and replace the starter, I replaced the ignition coil, I replaced the plugs and plug wires and the battery. It still wouldn't turn over. BUT if I manually push in the starter relay in the fuse box it will turn over. So that tells me it is something before that.

So then I replaced the ignition switch on the steering shaft, still no turn over, so then I replaced the ECM with the exact same ECM model, still no turn over. I disconnected the VSS sensor plug, still no turn over.

At this point I don't know what to try next. I am hardware literate, but not electrically inclined so some of the posts about using voltmeters to check flows go right over my head.

Anyone have any suggestions?

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Unread 07-31-2013, 03:27 PM   #2
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I want to add that when I turn the key the fuel pump primes up and the dash lights up, with the Check Brake light staying on if you continue to crank the key. So I think I installed the ignition switch correctly.
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Unread 07-31-2013, 03:33 PM   #3
jason280
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When you turn the key, are you getting any "noise" at all? Are you able to hear the solenoid clicking?
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Unread 07-31-2013, 03:36 PM   #4
jsipe007
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When you say wont turn over at all you mean that there is no engine cranking correct?

Have you checked the starter relay and circuit?
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Unread 07-31-2013, 03:50 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jason280 View Post
When you turn the key, are you getting any "noise" at all? Are you able to hear the solenoid clicking?
The solenoid doesn't click. I don't think the power is getting to it. The only noise is the fuel pump priming.

When you say wont turn over at all you mean that there is no engine cranking correct?

Have you checked the starter relay and circuit?


I'm not sure what you are asking here, If I change the starter relay in the fuse box it still wont crank, if I take the relay cover off and push it in manually it will crank.
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Unread 07-31-2013, 03:57 PM   #6
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Sorry, to clarify I meant,

Have you tested to see if the starter relay is good? For example have you tried switching the starter relay with a non-essential relay?

I see that you say you tried swapping the relay. This makes me think the relay is ok, but then you say if you take the relay cover off and push it in manually it will crank. Do you mean that you are taking the fuse box cover off? And what exactly are you pushing on? The relay itself?
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Unread 07-31-2013, 04:01 PM   #7
rambo3489
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My vote is for the starter relay. It's right under where the heater hose go through the firewall. About 1.5"x2". It will have roughly 8 wore going to it. It's what tells your starter to kick on when you turn the key to start. I had a bad ground on mine. Easy fix took 10 minutes to troubleshoot.

You'd be wise to teach yourself about schematics and wiring. Get comfortable with electric theory and principles. You will have MANY more wiring problems in the future. You'll thank me later

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Unread 07-31-2013, 04:02 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scraper View Post

The solenoid doesn't click. I don't think the power is getting to it. The only noise is the fuel pump priming.

When you say wont turn over at all you mean that there is no engine cranking correct?

Have you checked the starter relay and circuit?

I'm not sure what you are asking here, If I change the starter relay in the fuse box it still wont crank, if I take the relay cover off and push it in manually it will crank.
This tells me you have a loose wire on one of the coil connectors on the starter relay. Not sure this is actually the starter relay. The one I described above is the start relay which cover are you removing?

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Unread 07-31-2013, 04:05 PM   #9
jsipe007
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Rambo, thats what I am leaning towards as well. On my 94 YJ though, the starter relay is part of the Power Distribution Center next to the battery.

http://i702.photobucket.com/albums/w...l/P1000429.jpg
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Unread 07-31-2013, 04:05 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rambo3489 View Post
This tells me you have a loose wire on one of the coil connectors on the starter relay. Not sure this is actually the starter relay. The one I described above is the start relay which cover are you removing?

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The one I am talking about is in the fuse box next to the battery. You can remove the cover of the relay itself and push it in, which causes the jeep to crank.

I will look at the relay you are talking about and let you know.
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Unread 07-31-2013, 04:11 PM   #11
jsipe007
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Scraper, that definitely sounds like a wiring issue at the relay/bad relay to me.

You have verified the relay is good? You can check a relay using a multimeter and your battery, it is a fairly simple process. If you dont want to go this route, try swapping the relay with a known good relay.

If you have already done this and it still wont crank, it is likely a bad connection. Make sure all the connections on the back of the PDC are good that go to the starter relay
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Unread 07-31-2013, 06:00 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jsipe007 View Post
Scraper, that definitely sounds like a wiring issue at the relay/bad relay to me.

You have verified the relay is good? You can check a relay using a multimeter and your battery, it is a fairly simple process. If you dont want to go this route, try swapping the relay with a known good relay.

If you have already done this and it still wont crank, it is likely a bad connection. Make sure all the connections on the back of the PDC are good that go to the starter relay
I do have the same starter relay you showed in that picture. I switched it out with 2 other relays that are good and no dice. I can check the connections on the PDC, but where else should I check to make sure the wiring is good?
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Unread 07-31-2013, 09:45 PM   #13
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My thoughts are if you can push down the relay and the engine will turn over, there's a short/bad connection at the pdc. What you'll want to do is get a volt meter and run some tests. I will try to find a diagram when I have a chance but you should be able to check for continuity in each wire.
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Unread 07-31-2013, 10:12 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scraper View Post

The one I am talking about is in the fuse box next to the battery. You can remove the cover of the relay itself and push it in, which causes the jeep to crank.

I will look at the relay you are talking about and let you know.
To me that says one or both of the connections on the relay coil are bad. When you press it in manually it cranks. So the start relay on the firewall in the engine compartment is good. Your problem is with the realy you push in to crank it.

To troubleshoot:

Identify which pins on the relay are for the coil.

Remove the relay. Put a volt meter in the sockets where those relay coil pins go.

*I am unaware of the relay your talking about about. But if you cannot simply remove it leave it there and take your measurements from the coil. You will get the same results.

Turn the key to start. You should see 12 volts dc there. If not put one of your probes from the meter on a grounded metal part of the jeep.

Then with the other probe put it in one of the coil sockets. Turn the key to start. If you get 12vdc then you have a bad ground. If not try the other socket. If you get 12vdc there you have a bad ground.

If you do not get 12vdc at either pin with the this technique the wire supplying the 12vdc is not supplying it. Your problem is further up the line.

Good news is that there's not that much more it could be then.

Do these steps exactly and let us know what you find out.

Hope this helps.
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89 YJ.. My first jeep and I won't let it go. ▀||||▀

Current Project: None... I disgust myself.

[URL="http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f22/my-yj-build-adventures-thread-1356941/"][SIZE="3"][B]BUILDING THE YJ MY WAY[/B][/SIZE][/URL]
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Unread 08-01-2013, 11:36 AM   #15
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I'm going to try Rambo's suggestion when I get home. Does anyone know if the wires from the ignition switch on the steering column run directly to the firewall and then to the pdc or do they connect to anything else prior to that, specifically in the dash or on the firewall? I ask because I think the previous owner had an alarm system in the jeep and I'm wondering if there is a cutoff switch still in there that is muking me up.
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