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Unread 05-03-2012, 12:15 AM   #16
Doctor7474
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Hopefully a dual clutch transmission as Fiat has a large amount of money tied up in them at this time. Unfortunately this would be the end of the manual transmission...

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Unread 05-03-2012, 12:28 AM   #17
Marauder_Pilot
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Originally Posted by trw View Post
I am curious, though, Marauder, what aerodynamic changes are you referring to between the 11' and 12' models? put the two side by side and they're are identical.
They're there, but they're very, very subtle. The windshield was moved forward and raked back slightly, the grille is slightly different, I think there were some changes to the fenders as well.

The changes might have been '10 to '11, though-I can't remember if they came with the Pentastar, or in prep for the Pentastar with the interior refresh for '11. That's how subtle they were.

The whole list is on Allpar somewhere, but I can't remember where.

And, yeah, I hate all the misinformation and paranoia that flies around here.
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Unread 05-03-2012, 12:40 AM   #18
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From the very high number of soccer mom/brodozer style JK's they have been selling I would be very surprised to see the wrangler become more civilaized. If its selling so well already, why do major changes?

The biggest change I could see happening is going to a unitbody eventually, it will cut down on weight (improve fuel economy drivability), improve IIHS and meet future safety goals more easily. The biggest bears on the auto industry are those two things, mileage and safety.
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I see you also twizzled your scart lead. Well done! :thumbsup:
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Unread 05-03-2012, 12:47 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by Marauder_Pilot View Post
Pentastar will remain base engine, diesel likely, V8 possible.
.
I don't see the V8 ever happening, it attributed to the 5.0 explorers bad rollover problems in the late 90's and its worked against SUV's in rollover testing since.

If they were going to do it they would have by now. There is an SRT grand for christ sake, don't you think they would have made the connection that the wrangler drivers would be the macho rowdy bunch that would want a V8?
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I see you also twizzled your scart lead. Well done! :thumbsup:
92 XJ with ARB's, 5" lift, too much armor, 33's and some other garbage
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Unread 05-03-2012, 04:10 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by Marauder_Pilot View Post



Not legal. If you want something like that today, give Polaris, Can-Am, John Deere or Yamaha a call, they all make a mean side-by-side.


That is funny since I can drive a Bantam down the road or a CJ-2A. Have you seen a smart car? or a mini cooper? I think their attitude of a small car for the masses (500) could be the same way for the jeep.... Something simple so everyone can afford it. Wouldn't you like to see a jeep that can perform and be less then 20k?
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Unread 05-03-2012, 05:12 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by GrassLakeRon

That is funny since I can drive a Bantam down the road or a CJ-2A. Have you seen a smart car? or a mini cooper? I think their attitude of a small car for the masses (500) could be the same way for the jeep.... Something simple so everyone can afford it. Wouldn't you like to see a jeep that can perform and be less then 20k?
Vintage cars are only subject to the laws/regulations that existed at the time of production. So the Bantam & CJ2 arguments are irrelevant.
The smart car exploits deficiencies in US testing standards. It's so light it just bounces off whatever it hits. If they did a "pancake" test, the dummies would be crushed.

The 2 door JK already has a 'bad' rating. Being a heavy vehicle with a structurally worthless top, and questionable side impact resistance. Making it more CJ2-esque will only have a detrimental impact on its viability.
http://www.iihs.org/ratings/ratingsbyseries.aspx?id=634
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Unread 05-03-2012, 05:35 AM   #22
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im just praying that there will be a diesel powerhouse under the hood so when i am out of college ill have that option!!!
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Unread 05-03-2012, 06:35 AM   #23
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im just praying that there will be a diesel powerhouse under the hood so when i am out of college ill have that option!!!
Yes god please ^ this.

Maybe I'll be in a spot where I can buy a new Jeep by then and i'm holding out for a diesel.
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Unread 05-03-2012, 10:25 AM   #24
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A Lj type of Jk2 door in diesel.
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Unread 05-03-2012, 02:49 PM   #25
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No " arguments" here. I just don't want another $40,000 piece of plastic, or a "just" capable version you have to worry about it breaking or upgrades before you hit the trail. I don't care about the soccer mom hummer wanna bee crowd. If the new jeep appeals to only that crowd, they can keep it. When I went to buy a jeep I could have anything out there, I went for an LJ because a scrambler around here was darn near the same price.
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Unread 05-04-2012, 12:12 PM   #26
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That is funny since I can drive a Bantam down the road or a CJ-2A. Have you seen a smart car? or a mini cooper? I think their attitude of a small car for the masses (500) could be the same way for the jeep.... Something simple so everyone can afford it. Wouldn't you like to see a jeep that can perform and be less then 20k?
The Mini Cooper and 500 are safer than a MB by a factor of millions, and a lot safer than you think.


And, no, I wouldn't, not if it's the on-road deathtrap that the MB was. You know why the US Army no longer sells small vehicles to the public that aren't conversions of civilian vehicles? Because dozens of people who bought surplus MBs rolled and killed themselves.

And a base-model Wrangler is just over $22,000. That's not a lot of money. A JK is also far more capable than an MB-the only thing the MB has on the JK is width. And I'll take a vehicle that won't kill me if it rolls over.

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Originally Posted by Hussler View Post
I don't see the V8 ever happening, it attributed to the 5.0 explorers bad rollover problems in the late 90's and its worked against SUV's in rollover testing since.
It won't be a large V8. Not the Hemi, at least. There's rumour of a V8 version of the Pentastar (Kind of like 3.7/4.7) for vehicles that don't really need a V8 but sell better with one (Dakota replacement, Ram 50, Wrangler, possibly the next-gen Caravan R/T)

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A Lj type of Jk2 door in diesel.
Also possible, maybe instead of a Gladiator, maybe alongside, depending on how the J8 fits into the equation.
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Unread 05-04-2012, 12:35 PM   #27
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They do away with the solid front axle and it won't be a Jeep.
They actually made an independent suspension version of a jeep in WW2 (its the funny looking one with the horizontal grill slits), it was notorious for rolling whenever a wheel got lifted above the ground (the lifted wheel would sag and tuck, and bad things happened when that side of the rig came back down). Based on the history of ind. susp. jeeps and the purpose of the vehicle, I really doubt they would give up solid axles.
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Unread 05-04-2012, 12:38 PM   #28
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All I could really hope for is that Jeep would 1) narrow the JK about 6", 2) fix the entire front end (no more retarded fenders and grill), and 3) drop the price while still offering a decent engine. That'd be a vehicle I'd happily buy.
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Unread 05-04-2012, 01:08 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Marauder_Pilot
And a base-model Wrangler is just over $22,000. That's not a lot of money. .
Currently. Now add 3% each year until then and if they spent heavily to make the changes then add another $1500...... I have watched even used car prices do the same thing. So base on the new one would be around $25,000 in 2015 based on that trend.

What started jeep? Cheap multi purpose vehicles. Work on the farm then take it to town . Do you think that a base jeep that is as much as 30% of americans make in a year really going to appeal to the masses? What company wants to kill 30% of the market right off the bat? So if their new plan is to aim for only the top 20% that is a poor business model. Add in the fact that most people won't make the difference each year in raises....

Why are small cars selling right now? Price and mileage....so if you want to get more people to buy you don't high jack the price and keep low mileage numbers. Now you say true jeepers don't care about the mileage, that they want a true off road experience.... Did sales go up big time when they stressed mileage numbers?

Tho all safety issues aside, history has shown that the bigger you make it sales drop. Ford, Chevy and Dodge have seen their sales drop when they keeping adding new cool toys to their cars/trucks and watched the prices creeped up. The current jk unlimited craze is a bump that will fade once the soccer moms find a new toy. Then jeep will be back to its core group, but with a jeep made for a mom with kids.

Jeep needs to remember their core group and skip the fads, be happy with a true off road vehicle and don't mind 300,000 sold each year.
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Unread 05-04-2012, 04:37 PM   #30
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The current jk unlimited craze is a bump that will fade once the soccer moms find a new toy. Then jeep will be back to its core group, but with a jeep made for a mom with kids.

Jeep needs to remember their core group and skip the fads, be happy with a true off road vehicle and don't mind 300,000 sold each year.
The unlimited is not a fad, it gave Jeep so many more options. There's only so much you can do with a microscopic tin box. Now with an unlimited, groups all over the world are now looking at Jeeps to replace their old Landrover 110s and various other 4x4s who's makers have long abandoned their 4x4 lineage. And others who want a utility style 4x4 with *gasp* ROOM.

Try to lead an expedition in a TJ (good luck with that)

The sky rocketing sales 5 years ON is only proof of this.

Remember their core group? It seems Jeep did just that by creating the most capable stock Wrangler ever. Oh, sorry its not a rattly tin box like you wanted, but remaking the CJ would barely sell 20k a year, let alone 300k.
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