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Unread 03-22-2007, 08:49 AM   #1
LEAD_NOT_FOLLOW
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Ultimate Cooling System - QUESTIONS

Well it finally happened last night. Pulled up to a stop, hear the inevitable hisssss, get out and see coolant coming out underneath. Pop the hood, and it's spraying out of the hose at the waterpump housing. So I gues it's finally time to ditch the closed loop system and do the conversion. To date I have had NO problems with it, and with the addition of the 3 core it has cooled quite well.

So I guess now I'm out to peice together the ultimate cooling system for the XJ. I have way to much $$ in my motor to do otherwise. So I am looking for a bit of help (and advice) with what to do.

I know my 3 current 3 core will not work. I just purchased a 3 core for the '96, so I may just take that one and use it. So radiator is done.

I have been really looking at the Hesco waterpumps. I quote from thier website;

Provides 10 to 20% more cooling efficiency than the stock water pump. We have replaced the stock stamped steel 5-vane impeller with an 8-vane billet aluminum impeller to achieve this goal. The impeller is larger than the stock and lessens the cavitations of the coolant to create a more positive flow in the space between the impeller and the #1 cylinder. The dyno showed an additional bonus of 6 hp. and 2ft/lbs. of torque gain we weren't expecting. The horsepower gain comes from the impeller slicing through the coolant instead of paddling the coolant. Individual gains may very depending on what accessories are already in place and engine condition. Either way it is a worthy addition to any Jeep engine whether it's a street driver or an off-road rock crawler.

I figured if I was going to do it, do it right. It's not like I havn't blown useless money on my motor before. So question #1 is this; Hesco list's 2 different ones (part numbers), does anyone know what the difference is?

My next question has to do with the t-stat housing. I've done a lot of reading and it seems like nobody has offically came out and stated that I would need a new t-stat housing. Once again I was looking at the one from Hesco (high-flow).



The question is can i use the one from Hesco, or do I need an alternative?

So now, radiator, water pump, and t-stat housing has been addressed. I know that I will need an different heater control valve. What about the overflow bottel? Rumor has it, that they are no longer available from DC. I'm sure I can find an alternative, but my question is this; will a new style overflow bottel fit in the location as it is in the older (93+) XJ's on my '89. I know not a major concern for some, but with me moving so much stuff around with the supercharger project that location would be perfect for me.

And lastly, does anyone know a way, or figured out a way to use the HO temp switch to operate the closed system fan automatically?

So to recap with the questions;

1) What Hesco waterpump would I need. Or I guess the real question is; does anyone know the difference between the 2 they have listed on thier website?
2) T-Stat housing. Will the Hesco one work with my application. And is thier a difference on what one I will now need converting to an open type setup?
3) Overflow bottle. Will one from a later model XJ fit in the same location on my '89?
4) Has anyone figured a way to use the HO temp switch to operate the closed system fan automatically?

EDIT: 1 more question. I am going to assume my stock hoses will work with the new style radiator as well?

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Unread 03-22-2007, 11:17 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LEAD_NOT_FOLLOW
1) What Hesco waterpump would I need. Or I guess the real question is; does anyone know the difference between the 2 they have listed on thier website?
2) T-Stat housing. Will the Hesco one work with my application. And is thier a difference on what one I will now need converting to an open type setup?
Just got done talking with Bennie @ Hesco. Apparantly thier is only 1 waterpump for my application. It would be nice if they updated thier website with good info... And aditionally, from what he told me, the t-stat housings will work fine with what I am doing.

So #1 and #2 questions are answered. Anyone else have any input on the rest?
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Unread 03-22-2007, 11:26 AM   #3
89cherokeeJP
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let me know how it turns out i'm going to be doing that soon to need a good parts list and walkthrough
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Unread 03-22-2007, 11:44 AM   #4
gregmondro
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I have no experience with this since my XJ is a 99, but this link may be of some use to you

http://www.off-road.com/jeep/cheroke.../radiator.html

has part numbers and stuff at the bottom that may come up I'll also do some more searching and see what I can find about doing this conversion.

edit: i just noticed the link on that off-road.com page to the page about getting the switch to control the fan isn't working, here is the proper link to that page I believe
http://www.bigoffroad.com/bigpages/bigtech/xjfan.htm
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Unread 03-22-2007, 11:58 AM   #5
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Try running an aluminum Overflow bottle. I know a guy that fabbed his own, but i think Moroso has one that you could use. but im certainly interested in this thread, because im trying to figure out ways to improve my cooling system.
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Unread 03-22-2007, 12:06 PM   #6
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Well I just ordered the Hesco stuff. I think I am going to just run an aftermarket overflow catch can; that way I can just place it where I need it to be.

Thanks for the link Greg. I will bookmark it and use it for reference. I plan on probally ditching my fan clutch and running a full electric fan setup while I'm doing this as well. I just happen to have a SPAL fan laying around...

I plan on documenting the entire setup while doing it with part numbers, and where I got the stuff from etc. So I will just update this thread with the progress. Feel free to bookmark it now.
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Unread 03-22-2007, 12:31 PM   #7
lost honda pro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LEAD_NOT_FOLLOW
And lastly, does anyone know a way, or figured out a way to use the HO temp switch to operate the closed system fan automatically?
are you saying the closed systems used an electric fan?

are you planning on using an electric fan? or going with the OE-open system belt fan?

g/l with the project, sorry i havent had a jeep long enough to give you any real answers
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Unread 03-22-2007, 12:42 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lost honda pro
are you saying the closed systems used an electric fan?

are you planning on using an electric fan? or going with the OE-open system belt fan?
Both systems use a normal fan clutch, but they both as well have an aux. electric fan. The fan is turned on by a sensor, depending on the temp. On the closed loop setup, the sensor is located on the radiator itself. The newer open style radiators do not have a spot for the sensor, as it was located on the t-stat housing. So that is where the problem lies, extending the wiring on the factory sensor to the t-stat housing to get it to work like normal.

However I will also probally be removing my fan clutch and going with another electric fan that will run all the time once the motor is started. I am dropping my motor aprox 1" to try to gain some clearance for the supercharger and this helps with not putting the fan into the radiator with the different angle, as well as gives me a good sense that I won't be tearing up my radiator with the added torgue.
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Unread 03-22-2007, 05:21 PM   #9
lost honda pro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LEAD_NOT_FOLLOW
Both systems use a normal fan clutch, but they both as well have an aux. electric fan. The fan is turned on by a sensor, depending on the temp. On the closed loop setup, the sensor is located on the radiator itself. The newer open style radiators do not have a spot for the sensor, as it was located on the t-stat housing. So that is where the problem lies, extending the wiring on the factory sensor to the t-stat housing to get it to work like normal.
So if you going to run a constant ignition-hot electric fan on the radiator, what do you do with the loop for the belt driven fan? (if thats a dumb question, ill look for threads about it... )

Quote:
Originally Posted by LEAD_NOT_FOLLOW
I am dropping my motor aprox 1" to try to gain some clearance for the supercharger
that is the sexiest sentence i have ever read in my life.
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Unread 03-28-2007, 06:02 PM   #10
LEAD_NOT_FOLLOW
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I got a few things in today from Hesco.

BRX Hose Kit:



Hesco High-Flow Waterpump:



Hesco High-Flow T-Stat Housing:



Mr. Gasket High Performance 180deg. T-Stat:

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Unread 03-28-2007, 06:12 PM   #11
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Unread 03-30-2007, 07:59 PM   #12
LEAD_NOT_FOLLOW
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Eh, only update is I have the CSF now. Hopefully I can find some time this weekend to tear into everything.
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Unread 03-30-2007, 08:09 PM   #13
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new radiator should have had a spot for the sensor, all the ones ive delt w/ do. or you should have gotten a HO tstat housing, they have a sensor hole as well.
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Unread 04-16-2007, 08:48 PM   #14
LEAD_NOT_FOLLOW
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Well I was able to work on it a bit today.

I know some of this is pretty basic, but I decided to document it as much as I could.

First we are going to do the radiator removal. You will need to remove you front header panel to get to the radiator. To do this first you will need to remove a few pieces from your grill.

You first need to remove the 4 screws that hold the headlight bezel on.



You than need to remove the bezel, and the side marker. Once you have those removed you will need to remove the side marker bezel as well to gain access to the 2 bolts that hold the header panel on. You will need to remove 1 screw, and 2 bolts from the side marker bezel.



You than will be able to remove the 2 nuts that hold on the header panel.



Next you will need to remove several bolts and nuts from the radiator support so you can remove the header panel. Their are 3 large bolts on each side, as well as 2 nuts in the center.



Their are also 4 nuts hidden on the back side of the header panel at the top. These need to be removed as well.



And lastly, their is a single bolt hidden on the bottom side that holds the bottom in. This can be accessed from underneath.



Once you have all the nuts and bolts removed, you can pull the header panel out and than remove the radiator support. You do not need to remove the aux. fan (however disconnect it) as it will pull out with the support.



You now have access to the radiator. To remove it you will need to undo the upper and lower radiator hose, as well as both transmission lines. You will also need to remove the rubber isolator on the top of the old radiator so you can use it on the new one. Their are than 1 nut on each side that holds the radiator to the ac condenser. Once you remove these you can pull the radiator out.



Here is a comparison of my old CSF for the closed loop system beside the new CSF for the open loop system. Notice the only real difference is the filler neck. Also notice that the thermo switch is on the radiator on the old one, and their is no spot for it on the new one (we'll talk about that later).



I also at this time decided I was going to change the t-stat housing to a new Hesco high flow housing as well as change the t-stat. To remove the t-stat housing you need to disconnect all the hoses (3) going to it, as well as remove the 2 bolts that hold it on.

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Unread 04-16-2007, 08:49 PM   #15
LEAD_NOT_FOLLOW
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Once you have it removed, you need to scrape off the old gasket and remove any RTV that was their prior. A razor blade works well. When installing the new t-stat and gasket, I used a bit of RTV to make sure I got a good seal. I than installed the new Hesco high-flow t-stat housing. Notice that the new Hesco unit has hole at the top. This is due to the fact that the newer open loop system's from the factory have a thermo switch for the aux. fan. I have yet to decide what I am going to do with the aux. fan (put it on a switch, or use a thermo switch in the t-stat housing), so I placed a plug in it for the time being that can easily be removed it need be.



I next changed the water pump witch I will document at a later time. Now is a good time since you have the radiator out to do this job since you have room. I will update this post with a detailed write-up on how to change the water pump at a later time.


Next I reinstalled the new CSF 3-Core radiator for the open loop setup.



And than installed the new lower BRX radiator hose. This was honestly probably the hardest part thus far of the install. The BRX hoses are much thicker and thus less playable. I ended up getting out some hose lube and it than slipped right on.



I ran out of day light, so I will update the rest of the install at a later time with pics.
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