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Unread 01-14-2008, 10:41 AM   #1
smokeman
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Timing Chain Noise at Cold Start

Need some help on a noisy timing chain.

Specs.: 1996 Jeep Cherokee Country 2wd
Mileage: 170k

Recently replaced my front crank seal and noticed a great deal of slack in the timing chain. Decided to replace with an OEM Cloyes timing chain since I was in there. Ever since replacement, the timing chain makes alot of slapping noise at very cold startup. Once warmed up, the chain noise goes away. Any ideas? Maybe an oiling issue at cold startup?

Thanks

By the way, I did put the camshaft spring pin back in on replacement.

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Unread 01-14-2008, 10:45 AM   #2
mickdawg777
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Was the plastic chain dampener still in the cover? This prevents slack from chattering around too much. Sometimes, these will be worn down beyond recognition.
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Unread 01-14-2008, 10:52 AM   #3
smokeman
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I assume you mean this. Timing Damper Although, I thought it was rubber. Yes, it was put back in and did not have any significant wear that I could see. I put the narrow end facing the timing chain since that was the most logical position based on the timing chain cover slots. Did I mess up the orientation?
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Unread 01-14-2008, 11:56 AM   #4
tangofox007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smokeman
Ever since replacement, the timing chain makes alot of slapping noise at very cold startup.
Did you replace just the chain? As opposed to the chain and sprockets.
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Unread 01-14-2008, 12:16 PM   #5
smokeman
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Replaced gears and chain. Could the oil slinger be that loud if it was wobbling on the crank nose? It was pretty loose even when slid over the woodruff key on the nose. I just don't understand why it gets so quiet once it warms up after a couple of minutes.
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Unread 01-14-2008, 04:00 PM   #6
smokeman
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bump for the night crew.
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Unread 01-14-2008, 04:08 PM   #7
Jeds Sr.
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Doesn't sound like an oiling issue. You should have more pressure when the engine is cold...
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Unread 01-14-2008, 04:41 PM   #8
tangofox007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smokeman
Could the oil slinger be that loud if it was wobbling on the crank nose? It was pretty loose even when slid over the woodruff key on the nose.
The oil slinger should have been tightened up when you put the balancer on and torqued the crankshaft bolt. It gets squeezed between the balancer and chain sprocket. (Which is not to say that you could hear it if it was loose.)

How did you center the timing chain cover before you tightened it down?
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Unread 01-14-2008, 08:22 PM   #9
smokeman
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Didn't do anything special to center the timing cover. Just placed it back on and made sure that all the cover bolt holes lined up properly with the block. After that, just bolted it back on.
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Unread 01-14-2008, 08:24 PM   #10
mickdawg777
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tangofox007
How did you center the timing chain cover before you tightened it down?

Timing chain cover is centered easily through 3 or 4 shoulder alignment bolts, THEN you can install the rest of the regular bolts..
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Unread 01-14-2008, 08:26 PM   #11
smokeman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeds Sr.
Doesn't sound like an oiling issue. You should have more pressure when the engine is cold...
When I say oiling issue, I mean maybe it is taking time for oil to splash the gears, chain, and cover when cold startup after sitting overnight. I thought this because the noise dies off after a couple of minutes. Also, it only does it on first startup in the morning so I thought maybe the oil needed time to thin out which is why the noise would die off after a couple of minutes.
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Unread 01-14-2008, 08:37 PM   #12
tangofox007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mickdawg777
Timing chain cover is centered easily through 3 or 4 shoulder alignment bolts, THEN you can install the rest of the regular bolts..
Not according to the service manual. There is an alignment tool that centers the cover at the crankshaft. Alternatively, you can install the balancer, then remove it to tighten the bolts behind it.

I was not asking how to do the job; I was asking smokeman how he did it. If the cover was not properly centered, it is conceivable that the chain is making contact with the cover. Plus, the crankshaft seal will probably leak.

Last edited by tangofox007; 01-14-2008 at 11:09 PM..
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Unread 01-14-2008, 10:27 PM   #13
smokeman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tangofox007
Not according to the service manual. There is an alignment tool that centers the cover at the crankshaft. Alternatively, you can install the balancer, then remove it to tighten the bolts behind it.

I was not asking how to do the job; I was asking smokeman how he did it. If the cover was not properly centered, it is conceivable that the chain is asking contact with the cover. Plus, the crankshaft seal will probably leak.
Thanks, I appreciate the idea but it seemed to align with no issues. Also, the front seal, so far, is completely leak free. Another thought I had was that the old cam gear had an indent that was exposed outside of the cam gear washer. I wondered if the indent was to allow immediate oiling of the chain from oil passing over the camshaft through the front hole of the cam. The new Cloyes cam gear did not have this indent and the washer completely covers the camshaft oiling hole. Would this cause an oiling problem on initial startup of the engine after cooling overnight?
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Unread 01-24-2008, 12:27 PM   #14
SandD
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I have a '05 Rubicon with 22k miles and a noisy timing chain as well. Being under warranty I've taken it to the dealer a couple of times without success. They say it's not unusual for the 4.0s and it's not noisy enough to justify replacing it. It sounds like a diesel when it's first fired up and then a dull rattle while crusing. It's driving me nuts so I'm going to order the parts and do it myself. My wife's '06 has 20k miles and purrs.....
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Unread 01-24-2008, 02:17 PM   #15
smokeman
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Well, I figured my issue out. When I replaced my gears and chain, the cam walked out about 1/4 inch when torqueing the cam bolt down. That is why the chain was slapping the cover. When I took it back apart a few days later, I noticed the cam was sticking out and used a rubber mallet to tap it completely flush again. Also, noticed that the Cloyes cam gear has vertical space between its depression and the cam washer to allow oil to splash on the gears so there was never a oiling clearance issue. Anyway, thought I would update in case anybody else had similar questions or issues. My chain slap is no more. Now I just need to fix those sticky lifters.
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