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Unread 01-16-2014, 01:23 PM   #16
JBlue
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uga84
A. Start your own thread and find out. B. Search on this forum I am sure you will find your answer.
I apologize, I wasn't trying to hijack your thread.

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Unread 01-16-2014, 01:38 PM   #17
chriskeenan
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I know you said projector housings, and i know what thoes look like, but i have a feeling you dont have real projectors in it, post a pic or the lights with the lights off.

You may have some of the ebay knock off plastic H4 housing with a glass lens suspended inside housings. it looks like a projector but doesn't work like one, isn't even close.

If you have real projectors; going to a lower color temp (somewhere around 4300K) might help, you might have blue sensitive eyes, and the higher temp (more blue) lights are washing out your vision. aiming them right might also help, tons of foreground lighting will over power more distant targets.
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Unread 01-16-2014, 03:17 PM   #18
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Courtesy of EZEARL




Suppose to be the fix:
If you have stock fog lights on a 97+ and upgrade your harness in a manner that uses the factory wiring to trigger some new relays, your fog lights will have and/or cause issues unless you make some additional modifications to address the problem. It doesn't matter if you use a plug and play harness like the eautoworks or if you split your harness open and completely strip out all the extra factory wiring like I did. The factory fog circuit will cause your new lighting system to not work properly.

If you do nothing, your headlights will work as mentioned above. Low beams will be fine, but after you turn on your high beams, they will not turn off again until you completely turn off your headlights. Big issue here is that when you switch back to low beams, both the high beam and low beam filament will be remain powered causing your bulbs to endure 115W worth of heat output instead of the 55W or 60W that they are designed for. From what I've read this can cause them to overheat and burn out within minutes.

So what is happening? If you look at the driver's side headlight plug (and you have factory fogs) you will notice there are two red wires coming out of one of the terminals. One is a small 18g Red wire which sadly is the stock high beam wire. The other is an even smaller 20g Red wire which ties into Fog Lamp Relay #1 in the PDC. Please keep in mind that Fog Lamp Relay #1 is NOT used to provide battery power to the fog lights the way we commonly use them with aftermarket lighting. It is located before the switch and simply cuts power to the Fog Light Switch unless the Headlight Switch and Beam Selector Switch are in the proper positions. It does this as law dictates that you can't run your high beams and fogs at the same time. Though not a problem here in CA, I've read that states with safety inspection programs will fail your vehicle if the lights don't operate this way.

I dug into the wiring diagrams but had to have kastein help me decipher them because there was something about this circuit that just wasn't making much sense to me. I still don't understand the function of Fog Lamp Relay #1 in its entirety, but we're only concerned with the part that is affected by the headlight harness anyways. Essentially, when your Headlight Switch is off, the relay coil receives no power and therefore won't allow your fog lights to come on. When your Headlight Switch is turned on, one side of the relay's coil receives 12V which causes the relay to activate and send power through to your Fog Light Switch. When you turn your high beams on, 12V is sent out to your headlight socket via the Beam Selector Switch, and then is sent back to the other side of the relay coil via the skinny Red wire on that shared terminal. This brings both sides of the relay coil to 12V, thus causing it to deactivate and turn off the Fog Light Switch. Weird huh? The factory designed it so that the relay is off with both sides at 0V, on with one side at 12V, and then off again with both sides at 12V. While it makes perfect sense now, this is the part that was confusing me.

So what's the problem then? Well, it turns out that even when the high beams are off, there is still approximately 5V on that skinny Red trigger wire for some reason which I still don't understand. While this is obviously not a problem in the factory configuration, it becomes a problem when you are using the high beam wire (which is directly tied into the skinny Red wire) to trigger your aftermarket high beam relay. A typical automotive relay requires approximately 8V to activate and needs to drop to somewhere below 1-5V to deactivate. When you first turn on your lights there is no problem because the phantom 5V is not enough to activate your new high beam relay. When you turn your high beams on, your new relay gets 12V and kicks on. When you go to turn off your high beams, the phantom 5V keeps the new relay from deactivating and voilą, your high beams are stuck on...

So how do we fix this? There are a few common suggestions that are out there that I just wasn't happy with, and a few that sort of work, but not as required by law:

1. Don't use your high beams, new lights are bright enough anyways (OK...)
2. If you have to use your high beams, turn your headlights off briefly to get them turn off (PITA)
3. Pull various fuses (lose your fog lights)
4. Pull the fog lamp relay (again, lose your fog lights)
5. Modify the fog lamp relay (fog lights work, but won't cut out when your high beams are on?)
6. Install a jumper in place of the fog light relay (fog lights work, but switch is always hot?)

One post I saw got it right though. lilredxj99 mentioned it in another thread which I didn't find until after the fact. The details were a little fuzzy and I still thought the issue deserved some further explanation so that's why I just wrote this damn novel...

Oh yeah, so the right way to do it... Cut the 20g Red Fog Lamp Relay #1 ground/trigger wire at the back of the driver's side headlight plug. Extend this wire using your preferred method so that it is long enough to reach your new aftermarket high beam relay. Splice it into the 87 pin (output) of your new high beam relay. If you have two 87's (which is ideal), either one is OK. Do not however use 87a if your relay has it!

Yep, that's it... Your high beams will now turn off when they're supposed to, your fog lights will turn on/off when they're supposed to, and your low beams will continue to work as they're supposed to. Sure you could have skipped all the way down to the bottom and found your answer, but you wanted to know how/why it works, right?
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Unread 01-16-2014, 06:48 PM   #19
uga84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chriskeenan View Post
I know you said projector housings, and i know what thoes look like, but i have a feeling you dont have real projectors in it, post a pic or the lights with the lights off.

You may have some of the ebay knock off plastic H4 housing with a glass lens suspended inside housings. it looks like a projector but doesn't work like one, isn't even close.

If you have real projectors; going to a lower color temp (somewhere around 4300K) might help, you might have blue sensitive eyes, and the higher temp (more blue) lights are washing out your vision. aiming them right might also help, tons of foreground lighting will over power more distant targets.
Yea man I was thinking the same thing. But not sure..they were installed right before I bought it and the guy said "projection lights"..they don't look blue at all...just extremely dim. Got a harness with relays..going to throw it on tomorrow and see what happens. Will update.
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Unread 01-16-2014, 08:42 PM   #20
chriskeenan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uga84 View Post

Yea man I was thinking the same thing. But not sure..they were installed right before I bought it and the guy said "projection lights"..they don't look blue at all...just extremely dim. Got a harness with relays..going to throw it on tomorrow and see what happens. Will update.
Pull the housings out, it's like 6 screws to do it. Look inside the hole the bulb goes in. Is there a cut off shield before the lens? Can you see any of the inside of the housing bucket?

I'm betting on El - cheapo ebay housings for the horrible output.
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Unread 01-16-2014, 09:25 PM   #21
uga84
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Originally Posted by chriskeenan View Post
Pull the housings out, it's like 6 screws to do it. Look inside the hole the bulb goes in. Is there a cut off shield before the lens? Can you see any of the inside of the housing bucket?

I'm betting on El - cheapo ebay housings for the horrible output.
Probably so. But the guy said he paid 89 dollars for the housings. Hopefully this harness helps. I would post up a pic but I have yet to hit the 50 post mark. I can message you with a pic...but they aren't really close up.
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Unread 01-16-2014, 09:55 PM   #22
chriskeenan
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Originally Posted by uga84 View Post

Probably so. But the guy said he paid 89 dollars for the housings. Hopefully this harness helps. I would post up a pic but I have yet to hit the 50 post mark. I can message you with a pic...but they aren't really close up.
Image


It's hard to tell from the pic but they do kind of look like the eBay lights
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Unread 01-16-2014, 10:51 PM   #23
uga84
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Originally Posted by chriskeenan View Post
Image


It's hard to tell from the pic but they do kind of look like the eBay lights
Thanks for posting the pic for me. Yea they probably are the cheap ones...who knows. I will get a better picture tomorrow and see what you think then. Also going to put on the new harness... If it doesn't help then I will just buy new housing and bulb. Any suggestions?
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Unread 01-16-2014, 10:51 PM   #24
chris87xj
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.... I would post up a pic but I have yet to hit the 50 post mark.
I think it's 25 now and you are there!
You can also use the IMG links from your photobucket anytime and they'll show up as pics.
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Unread 01-17-2014, 12:06 AM   #25
uga84
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I think it's 25 now and you are there!
You can also use the IMG links from your photobucket anytime and they'll show up as pics.
cool...thanks!
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Unread 01-17-2014, 06:15 AM   #26
landude
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Originally Posted by uga84 View Post
Thanks for posting the pic for me. Yea they probably are the cheap ones...who knows. I will get a better picture tomorrow and see what you think then. Also going to put on the new harness... If it doesn't help then I will just buy new housing and bulb. Any suggestions?
I like these.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...A1CIVRACVETZ2I
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Unread 01-17-2014, 09:37 AM   #27
Paradise XJ
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Originally Posted by chriskeenan View Post
I'm betting on El - cheapo ebay housings for the horrible output.

Me too. Back many years ago I bought a set of cheap-o headlights off a guy on e-bay. They were SUPER bright. A three time brighter than my stock lights...BUT...the light went everywhere...There was no focus point and what little driving I did with them on there I considered very unsafe.

So, it all goes back to you get what you pay for.
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Unread 01-18-2014, 04:32 PM   #28
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Image


It's hard to tell from the pic but they do kind of look like the eBay lights


That's a nice looking Jeep!
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Unread 01-18-2014, 05:28 PM   #29
uga84
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Use these with stock harness?
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Unread 01-18-2014, 05:33 PM   #30
Xride
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If they are actually 6000k HID, then I am one of the people that will flash my LED light bar at you, especially if you are running a housing without proper cut off, because when it is real dark oncoming drivers can't see s***. It'll look white to you, but something more 4700k is better.
The farther north I drive the more idiots I see running 6000k ebay spacial HID in their stock housings. It's getting ridiculous. I liked it better when you had to spend a few hundred on even cheap HID.
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