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Unread 02-04-2013, 02:43 PM   #1
Donerstude
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Failed smog in California need advice

I do not want to go chasing my tail here, the jeep has a new oxygen sensor it is an 89 4.0 here are my numbers

RPM CO2% O2% HC(ppm) CO% No(ppm)
1337 14.3 0.5 121 0.31 9 Pass
2075 8.4 0.1 463 9.61 97 Gross poluter

I fail in the HC the max is 103 and i am at 463 and i fail at CO% max is 0.93 and i am at 9.61 way over the limit.

Anyone have any tips I do not want to just start throwing money at it, I replaced all the smog tubing about 4 years ago and all seems ok i do not seem to have any vacuum leaks and the jeep runs great I do not know where to go from here any suggestions?

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Unread 02-04-2013, 03:41 PM   #2
Paradise XJ
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Do the check list. None of it will cost you any money...yet. You might call this chasing your tail...but at least ONE of these things is causing you to fail.

Did you take it in cold...or was it up to temp?
Are you SURE about not having any vacuum leaks?
Have you smoke tested it?
When you say "smog tubing" what exactly did you change?
How are the lines to/from the charcoal cannister?
Did they just fail you on the sniffer and then stop, or did they check your EGR?
Did they pressure check the tank?
Gas cap?
CTS working? Test it?
Have you TESTED the O2 sensor/circuit?

http://comancheclub.com/topic/36382-...rs-renix-tips/

Now the money part:

Tune up lately - plugs, cap rotor?
Oil change?
what type of intake do you have? Stock? Aftermarket?
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Unread 02-04-2013, 03:56 PM   #3
MJR
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My first thought would have been O2 but you said it's new. Sounds like it's running rich or your not getting complete combustion of the fuel. How is the vacuum line to the MAP sensor?
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Unread 02-04-2013, 04:12 PM   #4
GetLifted
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Sounds like a vac leak AND a bad cat by those numbers.
If your 89 doesn't have a whole new exhaust by now then its never going to pass.
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Unread 02-04-2013, 04:24 PM   #5
Donerstude
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Did you take it in cold...or was it up to temp? I was up to tem had been driving for at least 35 minutes aftermarket temp guage read right at 210
Are you SURE about not having any vacuum leaks? I looked them over quite well, and checked for cracked brittle lines none were found
Have you smoke tested it?I do not know what a smoke test is please explain
When you say "smog tubing" what exactly did you change? there are several plastic tubing lines that run from the valve cover, to the manifold and from the valve cover to the air cleaner,ect
How are the lines to/from the charcoal cannister?the smaller one is in good condition the larger one is starting to show signs of getting brittle but does not seem to have failed (I will replace
ce this rubber line

Did they just fail you on the sniffer and then stop, or did they check your EGR? they did not stop after the sniffer they did pressure check the tank test I do not know if he checked the egr How would i know?
Did they pressure check the tank? Yes I believe I passed that part of the test
Gas cap? fairly new I also believe I passed that part
CTS working? Test it? I have not tested my coolant temp sensor I will look up how and run the test
Have you TESTED the O2 sensor/circuit? I have not tested this circuit I will look up how and run the test the sensor is new(although it could be bad)

How is the vacuum line to the MAP sensor?the vacuum lines are the hard plastic ones they have no cracks check out to be in good woking condition and were replaced approx 4 years ago

Thanks for the help I will test the sensors and report back I probably wont have time until tomorrow.
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Unread 02-04-2013, 04:29 PM   #6
Donerstude
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"Sounds like a vac leak AND a bad cat by those numbers.
If your 89 doesn't have a whole new exhaust by now then its never going to pass."
Cat was replaced approx 7 years ago I will drive it agound tonight and see if it glows it does not rattle, My first thought was a vacuum leak and i think i will do a more thorough check of all the vac lines.
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Unread 02-04-2013, 04:45 PM   #7
MJR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donerstude View Post
Cat was replaced approx 7 years ago I will drive it agound tonight and see if it glows it does not rattle, My first thought was a vacuum leak and i think i will do a more thorough check of all the vac lines.
A vacuum leak is more likely to cause a lean condition (high NOX) not a rich one (high HC). On the O2 sensor make sure the wires aren't melted on the exhaust manifold near the power steering pump (often misrouted when the exhaust manifold is replaced).
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Unread 02-06-2013, 04:48 PM   #8
Donerstude
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so here is what i have found which i hope will fix the issue of running rich and allow me to pass smog. first the aftermarket temp gauge is no longer functioning (if id been paying more attention i would have noticed this earlier). second my thermostat seems to be stuck open never allowing the engine to really get to temperature and therefor causing a rich condition. I purchased a new robert shaw @195 which i will install after doing a full coolant flush. I also bought a can of seafoam which i will run through the system. I will try to remember to post back if it passes or not.
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Unread 02-06-2013, 05:18 PM   #9
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Try seafoam and drive it about 50 and retest,we used to use that stuff to pass many cars that failed nox
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Unread 02-06-2013, 11:52 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 98muddyjeep View Post
Try seafoam and drive it about 50 and retest,we used to use that stuff to pass many cars that failed nox
You are referring to cleaning the injectors as an attempt to remedy high NOx (lean condition), but in the present case this would not be beneficial to OP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Donerstude View Post
Did they just fail you on the sniffer and then stop, or did they check your EGR? they did not stop after the sniffer they did pressure check the tank test I do not know if he checked the egr How would i know?
The EGR test essentially consists of a visual inspection, is it there or not type of deal, if you're supposed to have one. EGR only impacts NOx anyway.

New O2 sensor doesn't mean it's working properly, there is a bunch of aftermarket junk out there. Also consider testing/replacing your coolant temp sensor. And check your exhaust system for leaks, especially upstream of O2 sensor.
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Unread 02-07-2013, 11:03 AM   #11
jserna
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Hmmmmmmmm time to move!!!!
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Unread 02-07-2013, 11:51 AM   #12
MJR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jserna View Post
Hmmmmmmmm time to move!!!!
There are areas in CA that only require a smog for ownership change and not every two years like most places.
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Unread 02-07-2013, 03:33 PM   #13
98muddyjeep
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The seafoam will help clean carbon off the tops of the pistons which in turn will help run cleaner,we used to do this trick in the 90's when I was working as a mechanic and cars would fail for nox,did this trick and 8/10 would pass clean. I don't know how or why but it worked great I saw numbers as high as 400 drop to 120 but the car had to be run for about 50 miles and at this point it can't hurt
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Unread 05-06-2013, 02:20 AM   #14
hshark
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x3 on sea foam. Pretty certain it might be a cat issue as well. I would try sea foam then re-test
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Unread 05-08-2013, 09:12 PM   #15
dave564
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I have a friend with a son going to school in CA having a similar problem with getting his car passed out there. Here in MI, we don't test anymore. I had his son send him the title for the junker he has, his dad plated in his name here in Michigan, then mailed the plate and paperwork back to him. Now he just drives past the test facility thumbing his nose...
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