1987 XJ Wagoneer.. Ran out of fuel, refilled, now wont run?

hp383 · 06-13-2006, 10:53 PM

The jeep ran out of fuel, at least to my best knowledge it did. So I added 5 gallons to the tank, it shows just over 1/4 on the gauge.

Crank it over and it will sputter, but not start. Checked fuel rail, no pressurized gas there. I cycled the key on and off to listen for the pump, its working. And if I hold the vlave open on the fuel rail and cycle the key I get gas. A decent ammount will shoot out.

If I do this a few times then start the jeep, it will run for a short time, then die. Or if I keep it at a HIGH rpm idle with the accelerator it runs, but if you let off it will die. It just sort of sputters out, and will start to backfire at the throttle body.

While its running if you open the fuel rail valve there is good pressure there, if you open it again right after it dies, there is nothing, not even a dribble??? This seems odd to me.

Is it possible for the fuel return to be stuck open? Causng the fuel to just run through the rail without building enough pressure to make it through the injectors?

I have recently replaced the fuel pump, fuel filter, fuel relay, and fuel/injector fusable link. It was running perfect, purred like a kitten. then this... And right after I promised to give it to my mother for her to use. I need to make a 90 mile drive to deliver it to her, and to do that it needs to start.

Any Ideas on what is going on?

Deviant · 06-14-2006, 07:00 AM

Will it run on starter fluid? ((i.e. keep feeding it, etc))

Check the fuel filter and see if it's clean. Might be concerned with crap from the tank.

sqeekers · 06-14-2006, 07:17 AM

My Jeep Has done the same thing if you let the tank get to low. Take starting fluid as stated above and prime your TB. Crank the engine over and see were that goes. Repeat the above if it deos not work the first time, it seems to take mine about four cranks with the starter fluid.

hp383 · 06-14-2006, 09:38 AM

I have tried priming it with starting fluid. It will run, then will sputter and die.

I even tried direct wiring the fuel pump, and let it run for a few minutes to try priming the fuel system. I would bleed the rail a few times and have good gas pressure until I shut off the pump, then not a drop.

If the fuel filter was clogged then I would not expect to have fuel flowing to the rail while I was priming the system, or while the engine was trying to run. But as I said, if you keep your foot on the accelerator you can keep it running, but at a very high rpm. And during this time there is all kinds of gas at the rail.

Unless I missed something in your reply I think I have already tried what your suggesting. Are there any other ideas?

bryris · 06-14-2006, 10:25 AM

It really sounds to me like a clogged fuel line in the tank side of the filter. It would make sense that if there is something stuck in there, the increased flow of fuel demanded at higher power settings could push aside the debris....almost like a hard to open flap or something.

Just a thought. Why not get some new hose and replace the line to the filter?

tweekedknee · 06-14-2006, 07:58 PM

try putting more gas in it. XJ's are known for having trouble with less than half a tank if the fuel filter is going bad. My 97 will sputter on left turns if i have less than 1/4 tank

hp383 · 06-14-2006, 08:56 PM

Hey guys, I just replaced the filter, and pump, and any rubber lines at the rear of the jeep when I did the pump replacement a month ago.

I am doubtful that running out of gas would cause the fiter to plug instantly. And when I direct wire the pump, I get all kinds of fuel at the rail. Although It may not be the 40 or 45 psi its supposed to be.

I was it was suggested by a mechanic that I test the pressure at the rail and the rate at which it drops. If its a nearly instant drop he thinks I could be needing a new fuel pressure regulator.

I can feel gas flowing through the return line and it seems to be at a rather quick rate, but I wont know for sure till I get the gauge.

midnightmoon · 06-17-2006, 07:17 AM

Maybe when you ran the tank dry any water in there has now collected in the 5 gallons and is making it impossible to start. I just had a similar problem. It sounds like you may have this prob. Will it start if you put your foot on the gass when triing to start it? If it does run it till it will idil. Maybe drain the tank and lines. It took me 15 minutes running at high idil to get the water out of the lines then it was fine. Its worth a shot. It sounds like a gas problem to me (bad gas)

midnightmoon · 06-17-2006, 07:26 AM

I just reread your posts I would say for sure its water in the tank Use dry gass or drain the tank and still use drygas fill the tank run it till it idils it will idil again. And another thing never use starting fluid it wears your engine out very fast and causes problems if used alot so I never use it. instead I use a spray bottle of Gas I Know is good but it is usually never nessassary unles your not getting gas to the engine which you are so go with the water in gas route Im sure it will work for you.

Chuck Cook · 06-17-2006, 11:40 AM

I'm not much of a mechanic, but I am a chemist of sorts. What he means by dry gas (I think) is some alcohol based product and here is why. Gas and water don't mix. Water and alcohol do. So when you add alcohol it mixes with the water and carries it through to be burned in the engine. When I lived in a colder clime I used to put a couple pints of methanol in my tank each winter to eliminate gas line freeze. If it was me I would 1) put in about 4 pints of methanol (or see what they have at an auto parts store - but be sure it has a percentage of the xxxxx ol compond, that is the main ingredient should end in ol which indicates it is an alcohol) and fill your tank to at least 1/2. 2) I would change the fuel filter on the chance you sucked in lots of crude from bottom of tank. Again, I am not much of a mechanic, but I can see gas getting through at high RPM, but not enough getting through the crude for low RPM. Sorry to be so wordy, it's the caffeine, Chuck

**RockinXJ** · 06-17-2006, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by midnightmoon

Maybe when you ran the tank dry any water in there has now collected in the 5 gallons and is making it impossible to start. I just had a similar problem. It sounds like you may have this prob. Will it start if you put your foot on the gass when triing to start it? If it does run it till it will idil. Maybe drain the tank and lines. It took me 15 minutes running at high idil to get the water out of the lines then it was fine. Its worth a shot. It sounds like a gas problem to me (bad gas)

Just so everybody knows, water is heavier than gasoline, so water will sink to the bottom of the tank and be at the pump before the gas will. Water weighs 8.3 pounds per gallon and gasoline is about 6.25 pounds per gallon depending on temperature. That's why you see the rainbow on top of water when gas is dropped on it. It's floating on top.

Anyway, the only way to get water in the tank to effect the fuel system is if the gas dumped in it from the can had a bunch of water with it.

My vote is the line got partially clogged with debris from the tank when it ran out of gas. Maybe it clogged the prefilter on the fuel pump.

The first thing I'd do is change the fuel filter again. If that doesn't work, pull the pump and clean the prefilter. Yeah, it's a pain, but possibly necessary.

midnightmoon · 06-17-2006, 01:54 PM

the vehicle runs but not at low idil water is heavier than gas and ends up in the fuel line because the tank feeds from the bottom...When a tank is always 1/2 empty condensation builds up in the tank hence water accumulates in the tank over time this will cause a problem. I just had water in my tank from the gas station enough to make it not idil. when a vehicle sits overnight the water (heavier than gas) collects in the botton of the tank and in the low parts of the fuel lines causing problems. I have gotten jeeps veryy cheap because they sat and wouldnt run because of to much condensation building up in the tank. when you run low on gas the water becomes higher in ratio to gas causeing problems such as above. drain the tank use dry gas. he already replaced everything else it doesnt run at high idil. I can tell you a storry about running an engine at high rpms then spraing water into the engine know what will happen?

1986Comanche · 06-17-2006, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by midnightmoon

When a tank is always 1/2 empty

Maybe the fuel tank is half full and not half empty...

**RockinXJ** · 06-17-2006, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by midnightmoon

when you run low on gas the water becomes higher in ratio to gas causeing problems

Ok, since we both agree water is heavier than gas, and the tanks feed from the bottom, then why is the water not sucked up before the gas from the fuel intake at the bottom of the tank?

This doesn't make sense. If the water is at the bottom by the pump and the gas is above that level, wouldn't the pump suck up the water first, then the gas when it got down to that level?

Unless I'm just clueless, the fuel pumps do not have a water / gas seperator.

I'm still sticking with my diagnosis about crud in the lines. It is very possible on a vehicle that's almost 20 years old to have junk in the tank, and since he replaced the fuel pump, it's also very possible to have disturbed some of that junk. If he took the tank and had it cleaned and lined I'd be out of order, but nothing was said about that.

Anyway, good luck with the problem.

midnightmoon · 06-17-2006, 02:38 PM

This is my view his jeep runs at high idle but sputters and wont idle and stalls. This meens the line isnt clogged. If the line is clogged then it might idle but no high idle. If that was the case then yes debree in the tank is the likely culprit. when you run a vehicle at high idle you can spray water right into the engine and it wont stall. but if you let the rpms go down it will stall. This is a trick to clean excess carbon out of an engine. It actually steam cleans the engine. Look at the facts it wont idle but it will run. If it idled but wouldnt run then there would be a lack of fuel thats not the case. The case is it runs but wont idle which may be water in the gas or maybe a sensor. But first and easiest test is dry gas and run it at high idle for ten minutes and I bet you it will work sinse the same thing just happened to me this morning. I put dry gas in a jeep cherokee that woulldnt idle 10 minuets at high idle then it would idle hence water in the line.